V90 inside london's ULEZ

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by derek vivian

Can anyone explain just how a vehicle is recorded as entering ULEZ area? Surely there are not cameras at every turn off from the North and South Circulars! And if TFL is using ANPR (automatic number plate recognition) cameras where does the mobile signal go to report an 'intruder'? and how does it differentiate between those that can go through ULEZ and those that can't? This leaves me somewhat thinking it is really just a move by TFL to rely on drivers obeying their demand. If there are no ULEZ signs at the entrance to all those turnings off the N&S Circular roads the rule cannot be enforced surely?

They do use ANPR, i don't know where the signal goes from the camera but presumably to a central computer that records your reg number and waits for you to pay the charge. If you don't pay within the proscribed time, it automatically issues you with a fine for not paying. I think you'll find there are plenty of signs but it's been so well publicised i'd be surprised if anybody didn't know about it.
Also i might be wrong on this but i was under the impression the north and south circs were included in the ULEZ and there are plenty of cameras on those!

I know some years back now, i went on the North Circ for a couple of miles, didn't think i'd been in the Congestion Zone so didn't bother paying the fee and got a letter through the post "inviting" me to pay it with a 50% surcharge for not paying it in the first place. That's why i think the N & S Circs are part of the ULEZ.

[derek vivian]

Dave, according to TFL's web site ULEZ is inside only the N&S Circular roads, but not including them. So one can drive around, but not turn in which is why I am curious as to how many cameras have been installed on all those small roads leading off the Circular roads!

[griston64]

Originally Posted by derek vivian

Dave, according to TFL's web site ULEZ is inside only the N&S Circular roads, but not including them. So one can drive around, but not turn in which is why I am curious as to how many cameras have been installed on all those small roads leading off the Circular roads!

It's being expanded from tomorrow. Not sure by how much but the car I recently bought from Hampstead was going to in it from tomorrow

[bob12]

As indicated ^^^ the new zone does NOT include the actual N/S Circular roadway so you can drive round London on the N/S Circular but, it is effective via ANPR as soon as you turn off further into London.

The daily charge for non- compliant cars is £12.50. It is a daily charge midnight to midnight so if you go in at 11.59pm and leave at 00.01am you will get a charge of £25!! There is a much higher charge for non-compliant large vehicles.

Bob

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by derek vivian

Dave, according to TFL's web site ULEZ is inside only the N&S Circular roads, but not including them. So one can drive around, but not turn in which is why I am curious as to how many cameras have been installed on all those small roads leading off the Circular roads!

The size of the cameras these days is so small you'd be lucky to see them while driving Derek - perhaps as a passenger or if you were stuck in traffic you might spot them but even then, they're so small you couldn't really be sure if they're cameras or not.

Maybe contacting TfL would give you the answer on how many cameras are installed but i doubt it. They won't want to give away their secrets!

I wonder though, hypothetically, if someone from outside London planned on using the North Circ for example to travel from the A12 to the A10 avoiding the M25 and there was a diversion (let's say a water main burst) that forced them into the ULEZ if they'd still have to pay?

[JJD1]

Originally Posted by bob12

As indicated ^^^ the new zone does NOT include the actual N/S Circular roadway so you can drive round London on the N/S Circular but, it is effective via ANPR as soon as you turn off further into London.

The daily charge for non- compliant cars is £12.50. It is a daily charge midnight to midnight so if you go in at 11.59pm and leave at 00.01am you will get a charge of £25!! There is a much higher charge for non-compliant large vehicles.

Bob

Not exactly correct .I am 2 mins away from North circ . Yes the whole of the North and south circ are free .But so are many junctions coming off the north circ to get access going north etc .For example.. Arnos Grove going towards Wembley . You get to the colney hatch or the next one by the cinema /swimming pool .In order to go north you have to leave , go round and then back up towards tescos .North finchley etc .THose small sections are NOT ULEZ . But here is the trick ... Most of our Eastern European friends have gone and bought Polish registered cars again etc ! For the whole purpose of not been charged. They keep it all legal by only having them in the UK for x amount of time etc . SO we get done, foreign plate cars dont.

[JJD1]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

The size of the cameras these days is so small you'd be lucky to see them while driving Derek - perhaps as a passenger or if you were stuck in traffic you might spot them but even then, they're so small you couldn't really be sure if they're cameras or not.

Maybe contacting TfL would give you the answer on how many cameras are installed but i doubt it. They won't want to give away their secrets!

I wonder though, hypothetically, if someone from outside London planned on using the North Circ for example to travel from the A12 to the A10 avoiding the M25 and there was a diversion (let's say a water main burst) that forced them into the ULEZ if they'd still have to pay?

I would say YES . Same as going through a red to let police through.You get fined .

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by TonyS9

Not sure if that is sarcasm, but to explain, burning fossil fuels causes pollution AND greenhouse gases that causes climate change. Pollution is temporary and local, greenhouses gases like CO2 are permanent until they are captured and changed by photosynthesis or other chemical processes.

We can breath the small concentrations of CO2 that cause climate change without harm, we cannot beathe the pollution without consequences.

I can have it both ways.. If you understood the difference.

ULEZ is for pollution not climate change. Road tax is for climate change, EV subsidies are for climate change, carbon neutral targets are for climate change.

They may be on a detail scale but looking at the OED definition of pollution ia making air, water, soil, etc. dirty; the state of being dirty :

https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionari...lish/pollution


Paraphrasing that to apply to an internal combustion engine is any by-product of the fuel burning that isn't usable, in other words anything exiting the cylinders via the exhaust valves into the exhaust system. If you want to split that down into greenhose gases that's fine, just don't try and make them two different things as if they are intrinsically. They are both produced as pollution by the ICE.

Let;s not forget millions of people willingly drink CO2 daily and some even get upset when they can't get their favourite carbonated drink - where do the greenhouse gases from fizzy drinks go to? Should we stop making carbonated drinks worldwide? That would certainly reduce the amount of CO2 floating about.

These days VED simply goes to swell the governments coffers, once upon a time it was for the building and upkeep of the road system, hence the original name of Road Fund Licence. In fact, the government could do a lot to reduce emissions simply by fixing the roads. There is an untold amount of pollution created by potholes from damaged tyres that can no longer be used, waste suspension components and so on, not to mention slowing for potholes then accelerating again and it's a proven fact that causes heat pollution (plus brake dust) to slow the vehicle then accelerating to the previous speed uses more fuel and therefore more pollution than if the vehicle had been able to continue unhindered.

[derek vivian]

No one in my opinion would choose to drive round London on the N or S Circular roads! I would prefer to drive around Suffolk on one of my favourite counties, but if I needed to visit say a sick friend or relative who lived in the ULEZ area I would willingly pay the charge! That's all!

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by derek vivian

No one in my opinion would choose to drive round London on the N or S Circular roads! I would prefer to drive around Suffolk on one of my favourite counties, but if I needed to visit say a sick friend or relative who lived in the ULEZ area I would willingly pay the charge! That's all!

I've done it several times when the M25 has been gridlocked but i definitely wouldn't have done it unless i absolutely had to otherwise.