Help required to fit overdrive gearbox

[tonydgray]

Hi all

I'm in the process of swapping my M40 gearbox for a M410(j type overdrive). The vehicle is a 1973 145 with a B20a engine. This is my previous post asking for help sourcing the gearbox etc:

http://www.volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=105852

I must admit that I have not been 100% sure that the gearbox would actually fit as outlined in the previous post but luckily all is looking good at the moment. The unit itself appears to be the same as the one shown here in this article:

http://swede.vortexmediagroup.com/sh...-B20-B18-Motor

I have done some initial measurements and have found that the bellhousing will fit although I have not had chance yet to fit it up to the block but its looking good. The input shaft has the same diameter nose, this was mentioned in the earlier post, so that too looks like it is the correct one.

I now need to get going ordering the bits I need to couple all of this together and need some help if possible. The bits I'm unsure of are:

1. Replacement clutch - the old clutch fits on the splines for the new gearbox so am I right in thinking that I just need to order a standard clutch for my car and it will fit.
2. Spigot bearing - as above, standard size will fit.
3. The flywheel surface is slightly scored from the clutch plate so should I get this refaced and if so is it worth getting the flywheel lightened at the same time. Flywheel lightening was mentioned in a previous post regarding mild performance upgrades.
4. There was oil in the bellhousing when I removed it so would I be right in thinking that this could only be coming from the crankshaft oil seal and I should change this at the same time?
5. The flange on the new gearbox is slightly bigger than the front prop flange, what is the best solution for this? Do you think it would be possible to unbolt the flange off my old gearbox and fit it onto the new gearbox?
6. How on earth do you measure how long the new prop should be? Are there any tricks?
7. If anyone has a spare steering column switch out there I'l love you hear from you!!

Apologies for all the questions but any help is very much appreciated.

Cheers

Tony

[laptoprob]

Hi Tony,

When the gearbox is out, you have a good opportunity to check the oil tightness of the rear engine seal. And the state of the clutch.
After you fit the M41, you can measure the length needed to shorten your propshaft. Check the flanges fit your shaft! If they don't fit properly, see if you can exchange them. And get the prop balanced with the adaptation.

[john h]

1. Replacement clutch - the old clutch fits on the splines for the new gearbox so am I right in thinking that I just need to order a standard clutch for my car and it will fit.
I think so. If you want to be 100% sure, temporarily fit the M410 with your old clutch and see if it works

2. Spigot bearing - as above, standard size will fit.
Ditto

3. The flywheel surface is slightly scored from the clutch plate so should I get this refaced and if so is it worth getting the flywheel lightened at the same time. Flywheel lightening was mentioned in a previous post regarding mild performance upgrades.
Yes to removing scoring. Not sure about lightening. I'm not implying that you shouldnt - just that I don't know

4. There was oil in the bellhousing when I removed it so would I be right in thinking that this could only be coming from the crankshaft oil seal and I should change this at the same time?
I would change the crank rear seal and the gearbox front seal as a matter of course, while the engine and are box separated. (Off topic, but maybe a good time to change the sump gasket as well)

5. The flange on the new gearbox is slightly bigger than the front prop flange, what is the best solution for this? Do you think it would be possible to unbolt the flange off my old gearbox and fit it onto the new gearbox?
Don't know. Could you get the front prop section form the car that the gearbox came from?

6. How on earth do you measure how long the new prop should be? Are there any tricks?
You don't need to be super-precise, due to the sliding splines (at least, that's the case on my 164). When I converted, I measured the length of the OD gearbox against the 4-speed, then had the difference removed from my old prop. Fits fine.

7. If anyone has a spare steering column switch out there I'l love you hear from you!!
No, but if it helps, I adapted a Triumph column OD switch to fit and it matches nicely with the Volvo column switches

Cheers

John

[tonydgray]

Thank you very much for your comments John that was exactly the help I was looking for. That's good news regarding the triumph column switch as there seem to be quite a few of those on ebay, that's more than can be said for the volvo ones!

Hopefully going to make some good progress this week so I'll keep the post updated with anything new. Thanks again.

Cheers

Tony

[tonydgray]

Hi guys. All going well getting the bits sorted for the overdrive install although I have come up against a problem.

Basically, the flange on the overdrive is of the large variety and the flange on the front of my propshaft is of the small variety(87mm external diameter) and hence the two will not fit together. For information purposes my actual propshaft tubes are the thin 44.5mm diameter type. Possible options so far are:

1. Locate a second hand J-Type overdrive small flange
2. Machine large flange to enable it to fit to my prop small flange
3. Change prop to large type to fit large flange

I currently have to renew two of the universal joints in my prop and get it shortened so if I could pick up a second hand good unit and maybe swap out the diff input flange...this is just me thinking aloud really so this may not be possible at all!

Any opinions are welcome and thanks for reading.

Cheers

Tony

[REGAL 144]

Hi Tony and all,
Been following your thread with interest as I have been down this road the back end of last autumn fitting an over-drive gearbox to my 1973 144, sorry not to have got involved earlier.
We also carried out virtualy all the works laptoprob and John have described, all was going well (yes you guessed it) till we came to fit the prop and found the flanges to be differant sizes, and this after reading about it in a previous thread. Bit of brain I have left thought surely if we centre and turn the flange a quarter turn re-drill output flange to match prop flange this may primarily be a solution. The output flange was removed (warning you will lose a drop of gear oil and will need to replace the oil seal) was centred with the prop flange (advisable to get a machinist involved) drill through from prop side with correct size drill, and fit from there. Dare I say I would call this an agricultural solution and in the 50 or so miles I managed to drive before the 140 came off the road for winter all seemed to run smoothly with no noticeable vibration etc. I stiil have to finish the wiring and reverse lights but am looking forward to relaxed criusing, it was great during the few miles done last year. Best of luck. Bryan

[laptoprob]

Hi Tony, are there no Classic Volvo servicing garages near you where you can try to swap your flange to a fitting one? I did so when I changed from a D-type to a J-type M41. No problem, easiest way.

I can reccommend one in Holland...

[tonydgray]

Cheers guys

Bryan - That's good to know that you've already been down this road, you may regret having told me that, more questions to come! Simon at Brookhouse mentioned the same thing regarding drilling new holes and like you say and like you say as long everything is nice and centred then that should not be a problem.

Rob - The only people I know of really are Amazon Cars and they don't have a second hand one of the correct size unfortunately but there must be one out there somewhere, its just a needle in a haystack.

Classicswede also had a good idea yesterday about getting an early 240 DL front part of the shaft and give that to the company that are shortening my prop so that they can use the flange off that.

This prompted me to give them a ring and check this would be ok. Low and behold I was told they could just put a new flange on for me for £30 to £40. I'm not too sure why I didn't ring them right away to be honest but that does seem like the best option at the moment. I can drop my propshaft off along with the output flange of the j-type and let them get everything sorted.

I hope to have a good weekend on it this weekend so hopefully some updates to the post.

Oh, and as ever, thank you.

[tonydgray]

Well where does the time go!! I've been working on the house for the last couple of weeks so no progress on the overdrive front unfortunately.

I knew that I was always going to have a problem lifting the gearbox and overdrive into place on my from under the car. To overcome this I've made up a plate that bolts to an old jack and then to the underside of the gearbox allowing it to be rolled into position and then lifted up to the correct height in order to be located. Its nice and stable and the jack rolls and lifts it with ease but...

After getting this sorted I thought I'd give it a quick go to see how easy/hard it was to pop the gearbox back on. After taking the old gearbox off I am left me locating dowels on the engine side for the bellhousing. The problem with this it that I also have locating dowels in the new bellhousing so I have to take out either the engine ones or the new bellhousing ones.

This may not actually be a problem but I was wondering if anyone has any idea of which one would be easiest/best to remove along with the easiest method?

Cheers

Tony

[arcturus]

A lightened flywheel could result in a less steady tickover