Sluggish starter motor.

[concrete]

Morning all.

Starting from cold my starter motor would be best described as sluggish, but it’s also the same (maybe a little worse) when hot. Anything in the middle and it hammers over and starts instantly.

Also, I’ve found that if I let it turn over three or four times from cold, then switch off and then try again, it turns over faster and starts easier. Outside temperature seems to have no bearing on the issue.

It’s a 2.4D.

Cheers.

[Clan]

Originally Posted by concrete

Morning all.

Starting from cold my starter motor would be best described as sluggish, but it’s also the same (maybe a little worse) when hot. Anything in the middle and it hammers over and starts instantly.

Also, I’ve found that if I let it turn over three or four times from cold, then switch off and then try again, it turns over faster and starts easier. Outside temperature seems to have no bearing on the issue.

It’s a 2.4D.

Cheers.

what is the voltage across the battery when the starter is operating sluggishly?

Then what is the voltage across the starter when it is sluggish ?

the fault has to be diagnosed with tests like this ,
it could be battery , starter motor or the heavy cable connections ...

[concrete]

Originally Posted by Clan

what is the voltage across the battery when the starter is operating sluggishly?

Then what is the voltage across the starter when it is sluggish ?

the fault has to be diagnosed with tests like this ,
it could be battery , starter motor or the heavy cable connections ...

The honest answer is, I haven’t got a scooby’s. I’ll get it checked.
Just wanted to see if there’s an obvious issue, before I hand it to my mate. He’s in holiday at the minute, otherwise I’d ask him about it. I don’t bother people with work issues when they’re away trying to enjoy themselves.

Thanks for the reply. 👍

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by concrete

The honest answer is, I haven’t got a scooby’s. I’ll get it checked.
Just wanted to see if there’s an obvious issue, before I hand it to my mate. He’s in holiday at the minute, otherwise I’d ask him about it. I don’t bother people with work issues when they’re away trying to enjoy themselves.

Thanks for the reply. 👍

Also worth checking the charging voltage, alternatoer belt tightness and condition, engine (near starter) earth and battery earth to body and starter connections. From the symptoms described so far it sounds like a bad earth somewhere to me.

[concrete]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

Also worth checking the charging voltage, alternatoer belt tightness and condition, engine (near starter) earth and battery earth to body and starter connections. From the symptoms described so far it sounds like a bad earth somewhere to me.

A bit late replying as I’ve just been so busy. Had a couple of chilly mornings and it’s been more sluggish from cold, but it got hot on a long journey the other day and even after fifteen minutes parked up it was really sluggish and wouldn’t turn over fast enough to start. I lifted the bonnet and left it another fifteen minutes and low and behold it turned over ok and started.

Just not had chance to take it to my mate, but another mate next to where I work put his tester on the battery today and that tested ok (the green light is also showing on the battery) He got me to start it and the alternator is charging just fine. He thinks it’s probably starter motor, but I’m wondering whether to try secondary earths first. Connections appear perfectly ok, in fact no signs of corrosion at all. I don’t mind chucking another starter on it, as they aren’t that expensive and it would rule another thing out.

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by concrete

A bit late replying as I’ve just been so busy. Had a couple of chilly mornings and it’s been more sluggish from cold, but it got hot on a long journey the other day and even after fifteen minutes parked up it was really sluggish and wouldn’t turn over fast enough to start. I lifted the bonnet and left it another fifteen minutes and low and behold it turned over ok and started.

Just not had chance to take it to my mate, but another mate next to where I work put his tester on the battery today and that tested ok (the green light is also showing on the battery) He got me to start it and the alternator is charging just fine. He thinks it’s probably starter motor, but I’m wondering whether to try secondary earths first. Connections appear perfectly ok, in fact no signs of corrosion at all. I don’t mind chucking another starter on it, as they aren’t that expensive and it would rule another thing out.

The secondary earths aren't going to give a problem with starting. They can't carry enough current to operate a starter so if your main earths are ok, it's time to get the spanners out and change the starter from what you've said.

One question though, how was the alternator tested and what were the results?

[concrete]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

The secondary earths aren't going to give a problem with starting. They can't carry enough current to operate a starter so if your main earths are ok, it's time to get the spanners out and change the starter from what you've said.

One question though, how was the alternator tested and what were the results?

He used a drop tester connected to the battery terminals and when I started the car it showed the correct charging current going to the battery.

Just started the car, 13 degrees and it turned over and started ok without giving the heat plugs chance to work. Bloody thing. 😊

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by concrete

He used a drop tester connected to the battery terminals and when I started the car it showed the correct charging current going to the battery.

Just started the car, 13 degrees and it turned over and started ok without giving the heat plugs chance to work. Bloody thing. 😊

A drop tester won't check the alternator. However there is a clue in what you just said - without using the preheat it started fine. That points to the battery.

What sort of battery is it? If it's a calcium/silver-calcium then it's almost certainly not getting a full charge and worse still, becoming sulphated as a result which will ultimately kill the battery in short order. Also is the battery up to the job of starting the car? It might be too small for the diseasel lump under the bonnet.

https://www.halfords.com/motoring/ba...ee-952465.html

That's what should be in your battery tray, normally i wouldn't recommend Halfords for anything much but they appear to be the only people selling these now. I've seen countless posts now where people have fitted calcium batteries and suddenly experienced starting problems because their alternators are designed for normal lead-acid batteries (with lead-antimony doping on the plates instead of silver-calcium) so won't charge the calcium variety.

[concrete]

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

A drop tester won't check the alternator. However there is a clue in what you just said - without using the preheat it started fine. That points to the battery.

What sort of battery is it? If it's a calcium/silver-calcium then it's almost certainly not getting a full charge and worse still, becoming sulphated as a result which will ultimately kill the battery in short order. Also is the battery up to the job of starting the car? It might be too small for the diseasel lump under the bonnet.

https://www.halfords.com/motoring/ba...ee-952465.html

That's what should be in your battery tray, normally i wouldn't recommend Halfords for anything much but they appear to be the only people selling these now. I've seen countless posts now where people have fitted calcium batteries and suddenly experienced starting problems because their alternators are designed for normal lead-acid batteries (with lead-antimony doping on the plates instead of silver-calcium) so won't charge the calcium variety.

It’s a Yuasa YBX3019 95 Ah 850A

It has been on there a few years.

The needle on the drop tester went into the charging ok section and stayed there while the car was running.

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by concrete

It’s a Yuasa YBX3019 95 Ah 850A

It has been on there a few years.

The needle on the drop tester went into the charging ok section and stayed there while the car was running.

That's not a proper charging test. However, it appears your battery is indeed a calcium variety and is certainly way too big for the battery tray!

file:///C:/Users/Laird%20Scooby/AppData/Local/Temp/YBX3019_DATASHEET.pdf

Standard fit on diseasels is the 096 type which is also the heavy duty for the petrols. The battery tray just about accommodates the 096 which is about 60mm shorter. If it's a few years old already then it's probably past its best, without knowing the alternator output voltage and whether it covers all the load the car can put on it, you still don't know for sure if it's charging.

You'd probably be better off getting the Hellfrauds battery i linked to as a starting point, at least that will eliminate the battery as being the problem. Chances are that Yuasa battery is sulphated and most warranties don't cover sulphation as it's outside their control.

Don't let yourself be talked into a calcium battery at Hellfrauds, they won't last long on a car that doesn't have the right alternator!