AWD Transmission: - ATF - Its Brown and there's plenty of it

DG651 · Mar 2nd, 2012, 11:25

Guided by CLAN's excellent responses to numerous Auto queries, today I decided to check my ATF condition and level. There is NO guidance on this in my many handbooks, and some web sites say even checking should be left to an expert. Wrong, this job is easier than checking a fuse. Unfortunately, the dipstick showed a cold level well above Max and worst of all, the oil was brown - not black, but certainly not red. Does this mean gearbox oil is leaking into the Auto element?
I have had this 04 exec for just over one month (my retirement present to myself), it has done 116K and has a full VSH from the supplying dealer/garage. I am not a complete novice around cars, and decided against rigorous pre-sale checks as it came with a 3 month guarantee.
Although the box doesn't 'appear' to be slipping, is it simply a matter of time? Thanks for any responses to this and all previous advice - Dave

Rawas · Mar 2nd, 2012, 11:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by DG651

Guided by CLAN's excellent responses to numerous Auto queries, today I decided to check my ATF condition and level. There is NO guidance on this in my many handbooks, and some web sites say even checking should be left to an expert. Wrong, this job is easier than checking a fuse. Unfortunately, the dipstick showed a cold level well above Max and worst of all, the oil was brown - not black, but certainly not red. Does this mean gearbox oil is leaking into the Auto element?
I have had this 04 exec for just over one month (my retirement present to myself), it has done 116K and has a full VSH from the supplying dealer/garage. I am not a complete novice around cars, and decided against rigorous pre-sale checks as it came with a 3 month guarantee.
Although the box doesn't 'appear' to be slipping, is it simply a matter of time? Thanks for any responses to this and all previous advice - Dave

What is an ATF?

DG651 · Mar 2nd, 2012, 11:30

Automatic Transmission Fluid

keithC70 · Mar 2nd, 2012, 11:46

My advice is to get it properly flushed asap.

I've done a few of them now and every time it has appeared red or redish on the yellow plastic dipstick but when you drop the drain plug you'll see it'll come out black, or horribly dark brown.

I've just aquired a 53 XC90 with 100k, full volvo history, and when I flushed it, it came out black!

diy is easy if a little messy (lots of posts on this forum explain what to do) and you'll need 13 or 14 litres to flush it properly. I use the proper fluid but from vauxhall as it's a lot cheaper 93160393 about £7 a litre.

DG651 · Mar 2nd, 2012, 11:51

Thanks for the swift response. I have a pit in my garage, so the task shouldn't be too onerous. However, I am worried that if I flush through with new oil and there is a gearbox seal problem, the fresh oil will quickly become contaminated.

fungus · Mar 2nd, 2012, 12:11

There is only ATF (red) in the gearbox, and not any other gear oil.

TurboZutek · Mar 2nd, 2012, 13:08

I don't think there's any mechanism which would allow engine oil to mix with the ATF directly, is there? The torque converter physically separates both sections of the engine and transmission.

If it's brown and nasty, then it's old and done in, have it replaced. Make sure that whoever does it does NOT use a power-flush machine.

Chris...

DG651 · Mar 2nd, 2012, 14:00

Thanks, I guess I was getting confused by possible contamination from grease - as described in this thread:

volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=146140

I still am, but the excessive quantity leaves me wandering where has it come from? The car was not on a slope when I checked it.
I intend to change the ATF, a dealer states that the Part Number is 1161640 for 4 Litres, but I am a fair distance from a dealer. Does anyone know of an equivalent ATF. Also if possible the drain and replenishment [points.

TurboZutek · Mar 2nd, 2012, 15:09

Did you follow the check procedure to the letter?

The fluid must be checked with the engine running and having cycled up and down the gears a couple of times and then waiting a minute or two.

If you check the level with the engine off (for instance) it'll look like it's overfull by about two litres. Also worth noting, is that the 'cold' side of the stick is mostly worthless anyway and a 'HOT' reading is much more accurate.

Chris...

DG651 · Mar 2nd, 2012, 15:53

Chris - I owe you a drink! Just checked as you suggested and the level is much better. I can see now why they don't put any reference in the car's maintenance manual. Apologies for going off half cocked and reporting to the forum without checking all threads (I thought I had). I'm new, but I intend sticking with my XC90 Exec - it fits me, so does the forum. Dave

Mar 2nd, 2012, 11:25	#1
DG651 Junior Member Last Online: Jun 14th, 2020 09:44 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Forest of Dean	ATF - Its Brown and there's plenty of it Guided by CLAN's excellent responses to numerous Auto queries, today I decided to check my ATF condition and level. There is NO guidance on this in my many handbooks, and some web sites say even checking should be left to an expert. Wrong, this job is easier than checking a fuse. Unfortunately, the dipstick showed a cold level well above Max and worst of all, the oil was brown - not black, but certainly not red. Does this mean gearbox oil is leaking into the Auto element? I have had this 04 exec for just over one month (my retirement present to myself), it has done 116K and has a full VSH from the supplying dealer/garage. I am not a complete novice around cars, and decided against rigorous pre-sale checks as it came with a 3 month guarantee. Although the box doesn't 'appear' to be slipping, is it simply a matter of time? Thanks for any responses to this and all previous advice - Dave

Mar 2nd, 2012, 11:46	#4
keithC70 Senior Member Last Online: Jun 17th, 2024 07:30 Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Andover	My advice is to get it properly flushed asap. I've done a few of them now and every time it has appeared red or redish on the yellow plastic dipstick but when you drop the drain plug you'll see it'll come out black, or horribly dark brown. I've just aquired a 53 XC90 with 100k, full volvo history, and when I flushed it, it came out black! diy is easy if a little messy (lots of posts on this forum explain what to do) and you'll need 13 or 14 litres to flush it properly. I use the proper fluid but from vauxhall as it's a lot cheaper 93160393 about £7 a litre. __________________ 2013 S60 D5 Lux Nav Auto 2016 V70 SE Lux D4 Auto 33k

Mar 2nd, 2012, 12:11	#6
fungus Member Last Online: Oct 26th, 2022 09:12 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Spalding	There is only ATF (red) in the gearbox, and not any other gear oil. __________________ Current: S60 D5 SE geartronic 2004 161K Current: C70 T5 GT automatic 2000 192K Past: S60 D5 SE geartronic 2004 48K last seen upside down in a field Past: V40 2.0T Sport Lux Auto 2003 171K Past: 340DL

Mar 2nd, 2012, 13:08	#7
TurboZutek Premier Member Last Online: Jan 3rd, 2020 00:42 Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: NB, Canada	I don't think there's any mechanism which would allow engine oil to mix with the ATF directly, is there? The torque converter physically separates both sections of the engine and transmission. If it's brown and nasty, then it's old and done in, have it replaced. Make sure that whoever does it does NOT use a power-flush machine. Chris... __________________ Sealed For Life Transmission: "The unit is sealed until it dies from dirty, old fluid which should have been replaced."

Mar 2nd, 2012, 15:09	#9
TurboZutek Premier Member Last Online: Jan 3rd, 2020 00:42 Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: NB, Canada	Did you follow the check procedure to the letter? The fluid must be checked with the engine running and having cycled up and down the gears a couple of times and then waiting a minute or two. If you check the level with the engine off (for instance) it'll look like it's overfull by about two litres. Also worth noting, is that the 'cold' side of the stick is mostly worthless anyway and a 'HOT' reading is much more accurate. Chris... __________________ Sealed For Life Transmission: "The unit is sealed until it dies from dirty, old fluid which should have been replaced."

Mar 2nd, 2012, 11:30	#3
DG651 Junior Member Last Online: Jun 14th, 2020 09:44 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Forest of Dean	Automatic Transmission Fluid

Mar 2nd, 2012, 11:51	#5
DG651 Junior Member Last Online: Jun 14th, 2020 09:44 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Forest of Dean	Thanks for the swift response. I have a pit in my garage, so the task shouldn't be too onerous. However, I am worried that if I flush through with new oil and there is a gearbox seal problem, the fresh oil will quickly become contaminated.

Mar 2nd, 2012, 14:00	#8
DG651 Junior Member Last Online: Jun 14th, 2020 09:44 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Forest of Dean	Thanks, I guess I was getting confused by possible contamination from grease - as described in this thread: volvoforums.org.uk/showthread.php?t=146140 I still am, but the excessive quantity leaves me wandering where has it come from? The car was not on a slope when I checked it. I intend to change the ATF, a dealer states that the Part Number is 1161640 for 4 Litres, but I am a fair distance from a dealer. Does anyone know of an equivalent ATF. Also if possible the drain and replenishment [points.

Mar 2nd, 2012, 15:53	#10
DG651 Junior Member Last Online: Jun 14th, 2020 09:44 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Forest of Dean	Chris - I owe you a drink! Just checked as you suggested and the level is much better. I can see now why they don't put any reference in the car's maintenance manual. Apologies for going off half cocked and reporting to the forum without checking all threads (I thought I had). I'm new, but I intend sticking with my XC90 Exec - it fits me, so does the forum. Dave

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