Modern cars vs Older Cars, what do you think?

[SiRS2000]

I love them both.

I like the creature comforts of modern cars hence the V50 full of gizmos and luxurys.

I also like older cars whichdo tend to have more caracter, that said even my 90's RS2000 is far to modern for some as it has an ECU and Electronic fuel injection instead of carbs.

[weble]

For me each have their pro's and cons!

Modern normally brings Safety and economy (Compared to it's older counterpart).

Although i sway more towards old. I'd class my self as an ameture with the spanners, the most compicated stuff i've done has been change a diesel injection pump, a cambelt on a Ford CVH engine, Fit a 1100 ohv Fiesta engine. Anything more than that is down to my mechanic. So when it comes to that the repair bills on an older car are generally cheaper as i can do more my self, (Using my Fiesta and Sierra for examples) They dont even have ECU's to plug in and diagnose@ £50 a time. Then there are other modern gadgets like DMF's, ECU's, Sensors here and sensors there that i dont have, so less to go wrong.

My S80 is the newest car i've ever brought (although not what most would class as new), and i gotta be honest it does scare the crap out of me! In terms of what 'could' go wrong and how much it could cost! There is a lot less stuff i could do on the car my self too. But it's also the safest car i've even brought!

I guess i gotta get used to it, old cars wont last forever!

[Anadinolin]

i echo what people so far have said, modern cars for their creature comforts and economy - 88mpg some manufacturers are stating!!one!!!111!!!!eleven!!

i like the older cars because they are drivers cars, as much as i like traction control...it dosent like you HOONING about very much, the metals and alloys are much more fragile, and fiddly to fix - fiat grande punto's even use snap bolts to seal the gearbox to the engine so they can charge £2k for a new-ish engine - BAR STEWARDS

although seat design is good in modern cars - they hold you better and last longer, the older cars had some sense of comfort in them...my Escort cabriolet has sparco leather seats from a cosworth escort...they where the most comfortable seats i have sat in! after that an old renault 5 gt turbo

also older cars in the 80's and 90's tended not to have electronically speed limited ecu's it was just the mechanics of the car that limited your top speed!! the power the old group b rally cars used to produce...phwoar!

[andy_d]

whatever WE like or prefer ,doesnt matter.
the makers will Keep on adding more and more "Dealers only" bits as fast as they can.
Then prevent as many people as possible Other than their dealers being able to service them.

any volvo post 2000 is like that, you need £££££ worth of gear to turn a fkin light out,,,and volvo Wont sell you the gear as a private person....


older cars were Built properly, they lasted,, how may 740/940/960s are about now ?
volvo-fords,, well there failing terminally already.

fiat, dont make me laugh there a POS while still in the factory and only get worse from then on. any moron who buys one deserves all they get.

cars will Keep getting More expensive, lasting far shorter overall times and the "repair" bills at main dealers will get higher and more often.

progress?? no not for the owner/driver , fine for the brain dead morons out there who come out with "luddite" comments , or havent a Clue other than "fuel go here"
for the makers, it has to be better to make a car that Has to be serviced at stupid costs and at Their dealers only...

[Moosejaw]

Hmm, do I prefer a nice electronic ETM that needs half the front of the car to come off to change, and needs coded back into the car when (not if) it fails, costing close on £500, or would I prefer a £20 throttle cable held on by a couple of clips?

Or maybe I'd prefer an ECU computer-controlled engine management system which flashes warning lights on the dash and costs hundreds every time it finds a 'fault' over a carburettor I can adjust with a screwdriver?

To me, modern cars have gone too far up the 'sealed unit/plug it into a computer' route. Fair enough let's have fuel injection and airbags and so on but the complexity of modern cars combined with the expense of repairing them properly means that the life expectancy of a 2011 car is probably a lot less than it was for a 1981 car.

Look at the number of perfectly decent looking 52, 53 plate cars sitting in scrappies without a mark on them. Less than 10 years old yet because they're unfixable outside the expensive main dealer service bay, they're simply scrapped.

[volvorocks]

Originally Posted by Moosejaw

Hmm, do I prefer a nice electronic ETM that needs half the front of the car to come off to change, and needs coded back into the car when (not if) it fails, costing close on £500, or would I prefer a £20 throttle cable held on by a couple of clips?

Or maybe I'd prefer an ECU computer-controlled engine management system which flashes warning lights on the dash and costs hundreds every time it finds a 'fault' over a carburettor I can adjust with a screwdriver?

To me, modern cars have gone too far up the 'sealed unit/plug it into a computer' route. Fair enough let's have fuel injection and airbags and so on but the complexity of modern cars combined with the expense of repairing them properly means that the life expectancy of a 2011 car is probably a lot less than it was for a 1981 car.

Look at the number of perfectly decent looking 52, 53 plate cars sitting in scrappies without a mark on them. Less than 10 years old yet because they're unfixable outside the expensive main dealer service bay, they're simply scrapped.

Yes indeed I do agree.

Just a shame that newer cars go to the scrappies because of expensive electrical probs yet older 80's cars went to the scrappies because of rust.

Early cars and later cars being scrapped earlier than expected but for different reasons

Regards

[Jetmech]

Well!
Modern cars are generally well built, better than any pre 90's car IMO. But there are several issues. Waste, in an age when recycling is an accepted norm the car industry has gone in the opposite direction. You used to be able to reseal the brake & clutch cylinders, not any more. You used to be able to visit a breakers yard and find perfectly good second hand parts to keep your car running, now if you can find a breakers the chances are, especially with Volvo, that the part won't work because of computer programing issues.
But worst of all is the complete lack of technical information for private individuals. In the end maintaining a car comes down to spanners, with very few special tool needed, but the lack of legally available servicing & repair information is frankly dangerous.

[Andy Northface]

I remember reading in a car mag a few years ago that the manufacturers were pushing to use shear bolts on engines so there was NO or very little D.I.Y maintainence. Even oil changes would be frowned on!

[princepugh]

Totally hear what folks are talking about with modern cars in terms of fault finding, main dealer lock-in etc. and I should know - owning a 2001 V70 T5 has meant I've had to do a lot of background reading to understand these cars and keep the mechanics honest!

Having said that, my memories of the sort of cars my Dad used to drive around in (and these were new company cars) are not favourable: rotted exhaust within a year virtually guaranteed; front valance and sills rusting within no time unless undersealed; terrible suspension; poor handling; loads of body roll; ****-poor safety; terrible winter starting; bare and basic interiors; stinking exhaust emissions (no CAT yes Lead); and sooner rather than later, total rot boxes. OK, these were not Volvos but probably representative of many of the mainstream manufacturers of the late 70s early 80s.

On the safety front - take a look at some of the early NCAP test crash footage, then compare to more modern vehicles then think about where you'd rather be.

Agree though - modern cars are an expensive PITA in so many other ways!

[andy_d]

Originally Posted by andy north face

I remember reading in a car mag a few years ago that the manufacturers were pushing to use shear bolts on engines so there was NO or very little D.I.Y maintainence. Even oil changes would be frowned on!

and a Certain german car maker has seen to oil changes,,,
there is no sump drain plug on some of theres,,so you have to suck the oil out the dipstick tube..... what a crock that is.

for wossis chops pointing out that Certain cars in the 80s rusted faster than the warranty,, may i present to you Modern day FIAT, ford and certain french things that are described as cars,,

bro in law's father bought a brand spankin new fiat "stilo" , its not yet got to its 1st mot, but has had to have new exhaust bits under warranty, cos of rust...
bro in law sold his ,also brand new bought, stilo sub 3 years old, and despite him getting 40% off retail he took a right bath when he sold it,,during the 2 n a bit years he owned it it was back at fiat to have new clutch, new brakes (calipers) and various other Big works. and being a poxy 1.4 petrol engine, you can hardly say it was due to excessive power, or being driven hard, (he babys his cars, and doesnt put his foot down at all ever,,).

mr next door has a ford mundano estate, its only just 6 years old, he's got rusty tail gate , on the 2nd set of calipers/disks has had £1000's on/in the tractor engine (and it Still sounds like a bag of spanners in a washing machine) 3rd exhaust, and that one has been main dealer serviced from day one, either On milage or just before.
next door the other side, he has an audi a3 two door tractor, 2years newer than my volvo,, he's got more rust speckles forming than i do, and moans that the service bills are never below a grand for it @ audi,, and refuses to comment on how much his misses bwm 3 tractor costs,,,but they use the audi more despite having 3 kids and the bmw being a 4 door,,,