£3.00 charge to enter ULEZ zone for ALL cars

[Wagon Sailor]

Back to water cannons: where can I buy one? I've got to do something about all these cyclists.

[Moomoo]

Originally Posted by Wagon Sailor

Back to water cannons: where can I buy one? I've got to do something about all these cyclists.

Water cannon full of urine.............MMMMMMMMMM!🤔

[george57l]

"I've got to do something about all these cyclists."


Like this?

https://newint.org/blog/2014/03/06/w...ritain-protest


"Dietrich Wagner wasn’t quite so lucky. The 69-year-old retired engineer was left blind after a police water cannon in his German hometown of Stuttgart smashed into his eyelids."

I appreciate your comment was probably humorous, but be careful what you wish for. ;-)

[Tannaton]

Originally Posted by george57l

"I've got to do something about all these cyclists."


Like this?

https://newint.org/blog/2014/03/06/w...ritain-protest


"Dietrich Wagner wasn’t quite so lucky. The 69-year-old retired engineer was left blind after a police water cannon in his German hometown of Stuttgart smashed into his eyelids."

I appreciate your comment was probably humorous, but be careful what you wish for. ;-)

I get there are risks with Water Canons but there are risks with tasers and other methods. Whilst there is always a small chance someone innocent may get caught up - the chances of that are so small and water canons are an excellent way of dealing with large illegal gatherings without putting police officers at higher risk present in essentially hand to hand combat.

We should bring back rubber bullets too - someone climbing a statue to deface it *bang* no you don't.....

At the moment far more police officers get injured at this illegal and/or violent protests than people attending and partaking in criminal behavior and gatherings and that is absolutely wrong.

[Fika]

Been hearing for many years cyclists and cycle lanes cause or make congestion worse, but every time I'm in a car stuck in traffic, it's not behind a cyclist but behind another car often trying to dodge bus lanes. It's really a poor excuse to blame cyclists for why a city where people live like sardines has so much traffic. What better proof that cyclists cause congestion- have a look at the M25.

[george57l]

Did you read the article? Including the bit where it said...
"The truth about water cannon is being concealed: they won’t stop unrest. Boris Johnson himself has admitted that the weapon ‘would not have made a blind bit of difference’ in the London riots. Bernard Hogan Howe – the Metropolitan Police Commissioner now lobbying for water cannon – said in 2011 that it was ‘not the answer’. Senior figures in the police agree: water cannon is just not designed to deal with a situation like widespread looting."

And
"In fact, it’s hard to find a senior police officer outside the Metropolitan Police who supports the plans. Ian Blair, the ex-Met police chief, doesn’t think a good case has been made for their use in London, and five of the six largest police forces in England and Wales have said that they are against deploying water cannon."

But you know so much better than all these people, don't you? I'm sure you are correct that water cannon are an excellent way of dealing with large illegal gatherings just as you say, and these people all know sweet FA about what they are talking about.

I note that you specifically say they are a way of dealing with illegal gatherings (whereas Boris admitted they'd be no use), so I'm sure you would not want them to be used in any legal gatherings - demonstrations or protests - would you? Still you'll get your way at least in part any day now, as the latest govt legislation will give police the right to close down any protest they like, at will - any public gathering can be declared illegal in a heartbeat.


"Peaceful protests and marches could become a thing of the past under the controversial policing bill making its way through parliament, as being too noisy or causing too much “annoyance” would be grounds to shut them down.

The Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill has been condemned as “draconian” by experts across the political spectrum. It will effectively hand powers to police – and Home Secretary Priti Patel – to shut down protests in England and Wales at will"

and

Lawyers warned the Government the proposals in the bill “clearly violate international human rights standards”.

and

“The bill hands over the power of deciding whether a protest is justified or should be allowed — decisions we as citizens have had for generations — directly to the home secretary. That’s an extremely chilling development. It’s completely contradictory to everything the liberty of the free citizen is about in Britain.”

https://www.bigissue.com/news/activi...ht-to-protest/

There are probably also several reasons the powers that be have not sanctioned rubber bullets in Great Britain (N. Ireland is not in Great Britain). But I'm sure you know better than them.

You'll probably agree with the new legislation. Trouble is, it's all fine to restrict everyone else's liberty and freedoms when it's those you disagree with or disapprove of. But one day it might be yours. They are not doing it to protect you or the things you believe in, it is all to increase and perpetuate their own control and the interests of their 'friends'.

BTW tasers are targetted at individuals. It is rather harder to do that with a water cannon, and the trajectory of a rubber bullet is out of control and unpredictable if it misses its target. The risks are entirely different and the chances of an innocent person getting hit is not small. But then, none of us will be innocent once Priti and Boris get their way.

Food for thought, perhaps, rather than knee-jerk reactions. Anyway, I've provided some relevant information, so I see no need to debate this with you further.

[JJD1]

Originally Posted by george57l

Did you read the article? Including the bit where it said...
"The truth about water cannon is being concealed: they won’t stop unrest. Boris Johnson himself has admitted that the weapon ‘would not have made a blind bit of difference’ in the London riots. Bernard Hogan Howe – the Metropolitan Police Commissioner now lobbying for water cannon – said in 2011 that it was ‘not the answer’. Senior figures in the police agree: water cannon is just not designed to deal with a situation like widespread looting."

And
"In fact, it’s hard to find a senior police officer outside the Metropolitan Police who supports the plans. Ian Blair, the ex-Met police chief, doesn’t think a good case has been made for their use in London, and five of the six largest police forces in England and Wales have said that they are against deploying water cannon."

But you know so much better than all these people, don't you? I'm sure you are correct that water cannon are an excellent way of dealing with large illegal gatherings just as you say, and these people all know sweet FA about what they are talking about.

I note that you specifically say they are a way of dealing with illegal gatherings (whereas Boris admitted they'd be no use), so I'm sure you would not want them to be used in any legal gatherings - demonstrations or protests - would you? Still you'll get your way at least in part any day now, as the latest govt legislation will give police the right to close down any protest they like, at will - any public gathering can be declared illegal in a heartbeat.


"Peaceful protests and marches could become a thing of the past under the controversial policing bill making its way through parliament, as being too noisy or causing too much “annoyance” would be grounds to shut them down.

The Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill has been condemned as “draconian” by experts across the political spectrum. It will effectively hand powers to police – and Home Secretary Priti Patel – to shut down protests in England and Wales at will"

and

Lawyers warned the Government the proposals in the bill “clearly violate international human rights standards”.

and

“The bill hands over the power of deciding whether a protest is justified or should be allowed — decisions we as citizens have had for generations — directly to the home secretary. That’s an extremely chilling development. It’s completely contradictory to everything the liberty of the free citizen is about in Britain.”

https://www.bigissue.com/news/activi...ht-to-protest/

There are probably also several reasons the powers that be have not sanctioned rubber bullets in Great Britain (N. Ireland is not in Great Britain). But I'm sure you know better than them.

You'll probably agree with the new legislation. Trouble is, it's all fine to restrict everyone else's liberty and freedoms when it's those you disagree with or disapprove of. But one day it might be yours. They are not doing it to protect you or the things you believe in, it is all to increase and perpetuate their own control and the interests of their 'friends'.

BTW tasers are targetted at individuals. It is rather harder to do that with a water cannon, and the trajectory of a rubber bullet is out of control and unpredictable if it misses its target. The risks are entirely different and the chances of an innocent person getting hit is not small. But then, none of us will be innocent once Priti and Boris get their way.

Food for thought, perhaps, rather than knee-jerk reactions. Anyway, I've provided some relevant information, so I see no need to debate this with you further.

I have to agree 100% with you .

[Tannaton]

Originally Posted by george57l

Did you read the article? Including the bit where it said...
"The truth about water cannon is being concealed: they won’t stop unrest. Boris Johnson himself has admitted that the weapon ‘would not have made a blind bit of difference’ in the London riots. Bernard Hogan Howe – the Metropolitan Police Commissioner now lobbying for water cannon – said in 2011 that it was ‘not the answer’. Senior figures in the police agree: water cannon is just not designed to deal with a situation like widespread looting."

And
"In fact, it’s hard to find a senior police officer outside the Metropolitan Police who supports the plans. Ian Blair, the ex-Met police chief, doesn’t think a good case has been made for their use in London, and five of the six largest police forces in England and Wales have said that they are against deploying water cannon."

But you know so much better than all these people, don't you? I'm sure you are correct that water cannon are an excellent way of dealing with large illegal gatherings just as you say, and these people all know sweet FA about what they are talking about.

I note that you specifically say they are a way of dealing with illegal gatherings (whereas Boris admitted they'd be no use), so I'm sure you would not want them to be used in any legal gatherings - demonstrations or protests - would you? Still you'll get your way at least in part any day now, as the latest govt legislation will give police the right to close down any protest they like, at will - any public gathering can be declared illegal in a heartbeat.


"Peaceful protests and marches could become a thing of the past under the controversial policing bill making its way through parliament, as being too noisy or causing too much “annoyance” would be grounds to shut them down.

The Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill has been condemned as “draconian” by experts across the political spectrum. It will effectively hand powers to police – and Home Secretary Priti Patel – to shut down protests in England and Wales at will"

and

Lawyers warned the Government the proposals in the bill “clearly violate international human rights standards”.

and

“The bill hands over the power of deciding whether a protest is justified or should be allowed — decisions we as citizens have had for generations — directly to the home secretary. That’s an extremely chilling development. It’s completely contradictory to everything the liberty of the free citizen is about in Britain.”

https://www.bigissue.com/news/activi...ht-to-protest/

There are probably also several reasons the powers that be have not sanctioned rubber bullets in Great Britain (N. Ireland is not in Great Britain). But I'm sure you know better than them.

You'll probably agree with the new legislation. Trouble is, it's all fine to restrict everyone else's liberty and freedoms when it's those you disagree with or disapprove of. But one day it might be yours. They are not doing it to protect you or the things you believe in, it is all to increase and perpetuate their own control and the interests of their 'friends'.

BTW tasers are targetted at individuals. It is rather harder to do that with a water cannon, and the trajectory of a rubber bullet is out of control and unpredictable if it misses its target. The risks are entirely different and the chances of an innocent person getting hit is not small. But then, none of us will be innocent once Priti and Boris get their way.

Food for thought, perhaps, rather than knee-jerk reactions. Anyway, I've provided some relevant information, so I see no need to debate this with you further.

I have to confess I couldn't be bothered to read much of the article. I just listened to my dad - a retired Chief Inspector from of a large county wide Police authority. A long time ago, but back in the day when Police where not so shackled themselves.

I note also you've not addressed my very valid point that whatever we are doing at the moment isn't good enough by a country mile - too many Police personnel are being injured and there is usually no consequence whatsoever for those who gather for illegal activity, fight with the police and steal or damage property. There's no reason why we should have to tolerate such activity but we seemingly do in the name of human rights. It's pathetic, and soon we'll likely have no-one signing up to join the Police because they're just canon fodder in situations like that.

[JJD1]

Originally Posted by Tannaton

I have to confess I couldn't be bothered to read much of the article. I just listened to my dad - a retired Chief Inspector from of a large county wide Police authority. A long time ago, but back in the day when Police where not so shackled themselves.

I note also you've not addressed my very valid point that whatever we are doing at the moment isn't good enough by a country mile - too many Police personnel are being injured and there is usually no consequence whatsoever for those who gather for illegal activity, fight with the police and steal or damage property. There's no reason why we should have to tolerate such activity but we seemingly do in the name of human rights. It's pathetic, and soon we'll likely have no-one signing up to join the Police because they're just canon fodder in situations like that.

The street chav rats know the laws and how to play them to their advantage .then add in the free lawyers . Its a Joke . We need to be like the French and have the CRS

[george57l]

You can't be arsed to read the article in full (if at all) and you have the cheek to have a go at me for not addressing your newly-introduced point!

Your first post in this thread was a derail from the topic, on to how water cannon should not have been scrapped by Mr Khan.

This has been dealt with, not least by the article I posted, but also by several other replies. All of which you refuse to accept.

I'll simply repeat that the definition of illegal gathering is about to be hugely expanded. The moment they declare a gathering illegal (merely for being too noisy or too much of an 'annoyance') the chances of violence increase exponentially. In your world this would entail rubber bullets and water cannon being available to police to use against otherwise peaceful protestors.

I don't have to deal with any random new 'points' (allegations or claims) that you introduce (including the risible suggestion that we allow violence as a human right), moving even further off the topic. I see exactly what you are and don't need to indulge you any further.

This is supposed to be a General Volvo and Motoring discussion. Please take your political rantings elsewhere.

Bye bye.