Really bad fuel mixture problem - desperate!

[Louiseloves240s]

Hi
I really, really would appreciate some help from you experts, as my garage bloke has given up and has started to say I should get rid of the car, and I really don’t want to – No. 6 is my favourite of the six 240 estates I’ve had over the past 26 years (I’m not weird, they work for me and I love them, OK?), it has only 160,000 on the clock and is in really good condition apart from this. And it has leather seats and a very superior sunroof, and is my very favourite mid blue, and previously went really well (all right, I know the engine is more important…).

You’ll have to forgive me if I don’t know all the correct terms for things, but I hope you can understand me.

The problem is that for the last few months, the car has been increasingly running far too rich, it uses a vast (er!) amount of petrol, and the fumes from it would kill a horse - fortunately, having finally got to the end of the School Run, I don't have to use it too much. If it idles for long, apparently it is ‘hunting’, and although it always starts first time, if I go a short distance and stop the engine, it is very difficult to start it again, as I think it floods. The bloke at the garage explained about the various things that could cause it that he had checked with the limited diagnostic tools available for these cars – the correct code is apparently showing for it not being the temperature sensor (several AA men have suggested that the car thinks the engine is cold when it’s not, but the diagnostic thing doesn’t show this), and the oxygen sensor (not sure if I have the right name) is showing the right output voltage, or whatever it shows when you test it. He did find a wire not connected to something in the system, but it actually made no difference when he reconnected it

On balance, he thought it was most likely to be the fuel regulator (if that’s the name of a little round thing right in the middle of the engine, on top) and with my agreement replaced it, at some expense.

It wasn’t.
I can’t afford to keep trying different things without a reason, and he’s now suggesting that it’s the engine management system, and I should give up and get rid of it.

Last weekend, when it had been sitting for over 24 hours, it started but then ‘chugged’ and wouldn’t go, as it sometimes does when the damp gets to it – like the fourth one I had, it hates very wet weather and occasionally does this; it stalled and wouldn’t start again, although it was turning over fine. Garage man took it away and put new plugs on it, as he not unreasonably said that a couple of months of running that rich would have made them very dirty, and it has started perfectly all week, but it is now sitting forlornly at the bottom of the lane, having done an exact repeat of last weekend and having started, ‘chugged’ and stalled, and now won’t start at all. Garage man thinks this is connected to the same problem, which seems to be getting worse

Am in despair – they’re getting very difficult to find, and I thought I’d have this one for a while. Also can’t afford this!

Can anyone suggest anything, or is he right and I should give up?

Louise, sadly.

[morsing]

Hi Louise,

Can you find out what exactly the engine in your car is? There should be a sticker on the front saying something like "B200F" or similar.

What year is it, and what model? I'm guessing it's got electronic fuel injection?

[minesa240x3]

Just in the interests of helping out!
It's a 240GLT EState 1990 Automatic.Just had a look at her profile.Maybe narrow things down a little?
Fuel regulater was mentioned on top and in the middle of the engine.

This must surely be an easy fix?I had very similare symptoms on mine and it was the very thin pipe on the oil breather trap that had broken off.It just sucked air in but ran like it was about to die.Lots of reving just to keep it going and it did burn loads of petrol.

regards Brian.

[radiomark]

Start of by checking and cleaning the breather system and possibly replace the fuel pump relay.
http://www.volvoclub.org.uk/faq/Engi...eSymptoms.html

1990 that sounds like it could be b200f,just on the swapover year.

[Louiseloves240s]

Hi chaps, thanks so much for answering so quickly and wanting to help. I wasn't expecting anyone to get back to me so soon.

The car is still sulking at the bottom of the lane, as it wouldn't start today either, and it's raining really hard and very late, so I probably couldn't see the number on the engine too well. I'll look first thing in the morning.

I may have given the impression that the garage bloke isn't very good, which is far from the case - it's a family-run garage that's kept me and the kids on the road in a succession of ageing Volvos for many years for not much money and with enormous patience, and I know he is extremely competent, and will have checked the obvious things but he might not know the little details that a bunch of Volvo experts would know about, particularly if you've dealt with the same problem and its a bit obscure. Without replacing expensive parts one at a time, he can't think of a way of finding out what it is, and he's afraid that that could soon get to cost more than the car is worth, I suppose.

I looked at the link about symptoms for running rich, and the "Car Stalls; Bad Fuel Pressure Regulator Likely Cause" entry had one of the same problems as me exactly - I have also had to wait 20 mins outside shops several times when I've stopped the car after a short journey, but not every time, and the performance is ok, particularly when the engine is hot. It's not been as good lately when it's cold, though. I think I'll print out that whole section and take it to the garage, see if any of it helps.

Brian, I couldn't reply to your message because I've not done 30 posts, but I'm glad you enjoyed digs, I mostly sit in the lab and deal with the stuff that's been dug up, so I rarely get the chance to go on one, and usually long after the digger has gone!

[radiomark]

The fuel pump relay is about 12 quid online and is a good place to start if it's not been done.

[tannachyallen]

Does it have a lambda light? If so, is it illuminated? If so, has anyone read the fault codes?

Dave A.

[Clifford Pope]

" checked with the limited diagnostic tools available for these cars – the correct code is apparently showing for it not being the temperature sensor"


Presumably the air filter has been checked - not choked or disintegrating?

[Louiseloves240s]

I found the garage bill, and the fuel pressure regulator was the round thing that was replaced and turned out not to be the problem.

Re the fault codes: I talked to Craig at the garage. He said that on that little diagnostic plug that the car has, it wasn't coming up with the code for a faulty oxygen sensor (is that the Lamda thing?) or temperature regulator, he said it's coming up with the code for the engine management system running too lean so that the car is compensating for it. He's frustrated by the fact that you can't plug these cars into diagnostic equipment do that all the faults come up!

I suggested getting the fuel pump relay, and he said it could be that, he supposed (or several other things, he's a bit of a pessimist!). If you think it would be a good idea, I'll go for that - could you point me in the direction of where to get one?

He told me how to get it started - I have to take out the plugs and clean them; he said that the problem is that I'm not doing any long enough journeys at the moment for the car to get hot enough to burn all the filth off the plugs caused by the over-rich mixture, so although it had new plugs last week, the problem must be getting worse and they're filthy again. I can do that, (am perfectly practical, can't be that difficult) probably tomorrow as I appear to have woken up with bubonic plague or something this morning and have spent the morning in bed feeling hideous.

[tannachyallen]

Originally Posted by Louiseloves240s

I talked to Craig at the garage. He said that on that little diagnostic plug that the car has, it wasn't coming up with the code for a faulty oxygen sensor (is that the Lamda thing?) or temperature regulator, he said it's coming up with the code for the engine management system running too lean

I didn't explain that very well......the lambda light will come on when any fault codes are logged and stay on untill they are cleared or the fault trips the light again. It dosn't mean that the lambda sensor is at fault, it's just letting you know that there is a fault of some kind. The codes in my experience tell you the sort of area to look for the problem. They are not sensor or even fault specific. Several different problems could throw up the same code. Finding a mechanic with experience of these machines is worth a lot because they will know the sort of problems that throw specific codes.

Dave A.