240 General: New (to me) 1980 Volvo 244

[Clifford Pope]

Originally Posted by Othen

Thank you Clifford, but I don't think it would be possible to change the main bearing shells with the engine in situ - only the big end bearings.

It is - I did it. You remove one cap at a time, and push the upper shell round using a new one. You don't need to remove the crankshaft.

That assumes of course that the crank itself is not worn significantly, nor damaged or scored in any way.

It was a B21A engine, about 1980 vintage I think, with slightly knocking big ends. I replaced the shells, and thought while I had access it made sense to replace the main shells too.
That was with the earlier design where the sump dropped conventionally with no dismantling needed.

I did write up here, years ago, how to get the later sump off. The problem is that the deeper sump and longer oil pump do not allow the sump to be lowered enough to be able to manoeuvre the oil pump through the opening in the horizontal baffle plate.
In essence, you can free the pump through the available slot by undoing the two bolts with a spanner, and then letting the pump fall into the sump. You can refit the pump afterwards, but the problem remains of then getting the sump back in place. I read on Brickboard a trick - enlarge the hole in the baffle plate, by experimentation, until just large enough.

I improved on that, a bit unnecesarily I think, by bending a part of the baffle plate rather than cutting it off completely, and then bending it back into place once the sump was past. For that I used a length of wood of the right length wedged in place so that when I pushed upwards with my knees against the sump it bent the baffle straight again. I then extracted the piece of wood which I had thoughtfully provided with a bit of cord to fish it out of the sump before bolting up.
The exercise was to restore chronic low oil pressure, eventually cured (after some 300,000 miles!) by replacing the oil pipe rubber seal properly.
That was on a Torslanda with a B200F engine.

[Othen]

PPS. Dave: I don’t think this was the note from Luke I was looking for (re the AW71L) but it is another from him on the subject: “ It acts like a 4 speed but press the O/D button and it drops to 3rd and won't engage 4th. Also when driving normally you get to 65mph and it has a hydraulic lockup and the revs drop by another 500ish rpm so it acts like a 5 speed!”.

... so, from that description it looks like the O/D button on the shifter (the one I don’t see the point in fitting - although the AW71L box will come with the shifter) does prevent the box engaging 4th. It would also seem there the box automatically engages a hydraulic lock up for 4th gear above 65MPH to give an overdrive function (I quite like this idea).

I’m guessing therefore I’d need the normal electrical connection for the inhibitor (one of the reasons I’d like to use the RB’s shifter). I’m still not entirely clear whether the hydraulic lock overdrive on 4th gear is actuated electrically or whether the box does that hydraulically. Fortunately I have left myself plenty of time to do the research (a year or two).

:-)

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Clifford Pope

It is - I did it. You remove one cap at a time, and push the upper shell round using a new one. You don't need to remove the crankshaft.

That assumes of course that the crank itself is not worn significantly, nor damaged or scored in any way.

It was a B21A engine, about 1980 vintage I think, with slightly knocking big ends. I replaced the shells, and thought while I had access it made sense to replace the main shells too.
That was with the earlier design where the sump dropped conventionally with no dismantling needed.

I did write up here, years ago, how to get the later sump off. The problem is that the deeper sump and longer oil pump do not allow the sump to be lowered enough to be able to manoeuvre the oil pump through the opening in the horizontal baffle plate.
In essence, you can free the pump through the available slot by undoing the two bolts with a spanner, and then letting the pump fall into the sump. You can refit the pump afterwards, but the problem remains of then getting the sump back in place. I read on Brickboard a trick - enlarge the hole in the baffle plate, by experimentation, until just large enough.

I improved on that, a bit unnecesarily I think, by bending a part of the baffle plate rather than cutting it off completely, and then bending it back into place once the sump was past. For that I used a length of wood of the right length wedged in place so that when I pushed upwards with my knees against the sump it bent the baffle straight again. I then extracted the piece of wood which I had thoughtfully provided with a bit of cord to fish it out of the sump before bolting up.
The exercise was to restore chronic low oil pressure, eventually cured (after some 300,000 miles!) by replacing the oil pipe rubber seal properly.
That was on a Torslanda with a B200F engine.

Fascinating Clifford,

I'd never have thought that method of changing the upper main shell was possible!

Many thanks,

Alan

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Othen

... I'll have to check that with Luke next week when I collect the box Dave. He leads me to believe that 4th and overdrive are not synonymous on the AW71L box (which, he tells me, is different from the AW71 box).

I'll let you know the outcome once I've spoken with Luke and collected the parts.

:-)

PS. I was looking for Luke's previous note of the difference between AW71 and AW71L boxes Dave, but I can't find it (might well have been quite some time ago), so I just googled it and found what appears to be the answer on an Australian site. It would seem the AW71L has a solenoid that locks the torque converter (so it becomes a 1:1 drive) - that being the overdrive feature (and separate from 4th gear); if I recall correctly this results in a 500 RPM drop in engine speed when applied (whilst the car is already in 4th gear). If that is indeed the case then it is not a feature I'd need on the RB as I think the gearing will already be very tall for the car (the first 3 ratios are identical to the BW55).

Locking the torque converter is NOT OVERDRIVE!

Overdrive is a ratio, in this case 4th so not only is 4th synonymous with overdrive, it is the same thing.

The torque converter lock-up is exactly that, a clutch that locks the torque converter preventing torque multiplication and "fluid flywheel" effect.

You'll find 3rd on the BW55 is 1:1 in the box and the torque converter is infinitely variable between 1:1 and (usually) 2.08:1 with a stall speed of ~2000rpm +/-10% usually and 4th on the AW70/71 is ~0.7:1 depending on the exact application. This is the overdrive ratio.

Below a certain speed, lock-up won't be available anyway and usually comes in ~55mph give or take by which time the RB will have enough momentum to support it. If it doesn't, the box will either drop a ratio (simultaneously dropping TC lock-up) or depending on conditions, drop out of lock-up to give the torque multiplication from the TC giving the best of all worlds.

As far as i'm aware, it's a mechanical lock-up on the AW70/71L so no solenoids for this, might be wrong so i'll have to check. However i've not found any reference to a lock-up solenoid on mine (which doesn't have lock-up) even when reading the other parts of the HBoF. Also checked many times on Volvo information online.

From what you say above, it appears Luke is confusing overdrive with lock-up, they are definitely different things!. On my other beast, full TC lock-up is available from 30mph so i can drive along in 2nd with full TC lock-up. Giving it the beans and returning it to full auto by snicking the lever into either "S" or "D4" means lock-up drops out temporarily so it can change gear without compromising anything but once up to cruising speed, it re-engages full lock-up. Easing onto the throttle will do one of three different things, drop full lock-up for half lock-up, completely drop lock-up or drop lock-up and the ratio.
"D4" gives overdrive 4th automatically while "S" gives 1st, 2nd and 3rd automatically, pressing the "S4" button on the side of the lever switches overdrive 4th back in but still in "S" mode or "Sport".

I've only explained about how my other beast works to demonstrate that overdrive, no matter which box it's fitted to (manual or auto) is almost always <1:1, one of the notable exceptions being 5th gear on an Austin Maxi which was 1:1 but had a higher final drive to give the equivalent overdrive gearing.

If you were to convert to a manual M46 (4+ O/D) or M47 (5 speed box) having the AW71L in 4th with lock-up would be no different to driving in overdrive 4th or in 5th respectively. The main difference would be the box would change down and/or drop lock-up when needed, rather than being dependent on driver input to do it.

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by Othen

PPS. Dave: I don’t think this was the note from Luke I was looking for (re the AW71L) but it is another from him on the subject: “ It acts like a 4 speed but press the O/D button and it drops to 3rd and won't engage 4th. Also when driving normally you get to 65mph and it has a hydraulic lockup and the revs drop by another 500ish rpm so it acts like a 5 speed!”.

... so, from that description it looks like the O/D button on the shifter (the one I don’t see the point in fitting - although the AW71L box will come with the shifter) does prevent the box engaging 4th. It would also seem there the box automatically engages a hydraulic lock up for 4th gear above 65MPH to give an overdrive function (I quite like this idea).

I’m guessing therefore I’d need the normal electrical connection for the inhibitor (one of the reasons I’d like to use the RB’s shifter). I’m still not entirely clear whether the hydraulic lock overdrive on 4th gear is actuated electrically or whether the box does that hydraulically. Fortunately I have left myself plenty of time to do the research (a year or two).

:-)

I'd already explained this Alan :

Originally Posted by Laird Scooby

Overdrive is 4th gear Alan. The only electrics involved will depend whether you want to be able to lock overdrive out, other than that run an ignition-switched feed to the overdrive solenoid and it will automatically change into 4th/overdrive when needed. Using the switch on the side of the 7xx lever (that i'm fairly sure was shared with the 240) operates a relay to disconnect the feed to the OD solenoid and as that relay is a changeover relay, feeds a warning light (an orange upward arrow on the 7xx) in the sintrument cluster to warn you overdrive is defeated.

The shift quadrant is the same 1-2-D-N-R-P as you already have, if you want the OD defeat switch, i'm sure you could find a home for it and using one with a built in warning light will give the same info.

The relay actually switches the earth between the solenoid and warning light bulb if memory serves and in its "rest" position (not energised) takes the solenoid to earth, activating overdrive/4th automatically. When energised by the switch on the side of the lever it changes to earth the warning lamp (that has a +ve feed from within the cluster like the other warning lamps) and disconnects the overdrive solenoid.

Alternatively find a 240/740/760 with an AW box and the lever with the switch built in and fit that into your existing shift quadrant.

Also that quote from a few posts up from Luke confirms what i thought, he's confusing overdrive and lock-up - overdrive is 4th gear, lock-up is a different animal!

You will (as explained above) need to run a feed for the overdrive/4th gear solenoid on the AW7xL but you don't need the overdrive defeat button on the shifter - as explained already you can add a switch with a built in warning light if you really want to defeat the overdrive but unless you're towing or ascending/descending steep hills regularly, almost worthless.

[360beast]

As far as I'm aware it is a 4 speed gearbox but several people have been telling me it is a 3 speed with an overdive and a hydraulic lock up.

After googling I was right in the first place that it is a 4 speed gearbox, however it says 4 speed with overdrive and a hydraulic lockup for European models. So maybe the overdrive is being counted as a 4th gear, who knows! The lockup occurs at 65mph, drop to about 63mph and it disengages, you can physically feel the gearbox change how the car drives at these two stages.

http://www.nuceng.ca/bill/volvo/data...ranny.htm#AW71

If you press the "overdrive" button it actually just stops it from engaging 4th gear and an orange arrow appears on the dashboard.

All I know for sure is that I don't like automatics and my 940 is getting a manual

[360beast]

Just edited my post as I had a brain fart slightly but sorted it now.

[Stephen Edwin]

Originally Posted by 360beast

As far as I'm aware it is a 4 speed gearbox but several people have been telling me it is a 3 speed with an overdive and a hydraulic lock up.

After googling I was right in the first place that it is a 4 speed gearbox, however it says 4 speed with overdrive and a hydraulic lockup for European models. So maybe the overdrive is being counted as a 4th gear, who knows he! The lockup occurs at 65mph, drop to about 63mph and it disengages, you can physically feel the gearbox change how the car drives at these two stages.

http://www.nuceng.ca/bill/volvo/data...ranny.htm#AW71

If you press the "overdrive" button it actually just stops it from engaging 4th gear.

All I know for sure is that I don't like automatics and my 940 is getting a manual

That sounds like a "use lower ratios" button ... for use in certain demanding types of terrain, or types of styles of drivibg, or types of demanding driving situations?

Stephen

.

[Laird Scooby]

Originally Posted by 360beast

As far as I'm aware it is a 4 speed gearbox but several people have been telling me it is a 3 speed with an overdive and a hydraulic lock up.

After googling I was right in the first place that it is a 4 speed gearbox, however it says 4 speed with overdrive and a hydraulic lockup for European models. The lockup or the overdrive whichever it is occurs at 65mph, drop to about 63mph and it disengages, you can physically feel the gearbox change how the car drives at these two stages.

http://www.nuceng.ca/bill/volvo/data...ranny.htm#AW71

If you press the "overdrive" button it actually just stops it from engaging 4th gear.

All I know for sure is that I don't like automatics and my 940 is getting a manual

A three speed + overdrive is still a 4-speed box though. When the Mk2 Cavalier launched with the 5-speed box, a big thing was made of the fact that both 4th and 5th were overdrive ratios. To explain, 4th was something like 0.86:1 and 5th 0.71:1 - i might have those figures slightly skewed, i'm going on memory from 39 years ago now!

An overdrive, by definition is when the output turns more than the input so for the 0.86:1 ratio, for every 0.86 turns of the input shaft, the output shaft would give a full turn.
Likewise for 5th, for every 0.71 turns of the input, the output would give a whole turn.

Hence the data in the link you provided :

Transmission name: AW70

Type: 4 speed automatic
Manufacturer: Aisin-Warner (Japan)
Gear ratios: (1) 2.45:1 (2) 1.45:1 (3) 1.00:1 (4) 0.69:1
Notes: With overdrive (AW70), or with overdrive and lockup torque converter (AW70L).

Transmission name: AW71

Type: 4 speed automatic
Manufacturer: Aisin-Warner (Japan)
Gear ratios: (1) 2.45:1 (2) 1.45:1 (3) 1.00:1 (4) 0.69:1
Notes: With overdrive (AW71), or with overdrive and lockup torque converter (AW71L).

Both are listed as 4-speed automatic with 4th being an overdrive ratio. Therefore pressing the overdrive defeat button on the gear lever would lock overdrive/4th out.

There's nowt wrong with automatics as long as they're maintained correctly and in some cars are more economical (round town at least, sometimes on the open road as well) and half the reason many people don't like them is simply because they don't understand the "witchcraft" that makes them work.

[360beast]

We got there in the end then haha, so it is a 4 speed with hydraulic lockup.

I'm not a fan of automatics simply as I don't feel as engaged when driving them and for my purposes the M90 gearbox is stronger than the AW71L, I have seen people do an "accumulator mod" which literally means cutting some bolts down and putting them inside the gearbox, but I'm not in to such dodgy mods, longevity is the name of the game for me.

Also the M90 is such a smooth and positive feeling gearbox for me it is perfect. I do however agree that the auto in my 940 is perfect for town driving and stop start traffic.