Must be silly season M800GUL T-5R on Autotrader for £25000

[Pupbelly]

Originally Posted by Timmilne

Of course, a car is worth an individual is willing to pay based on their preferences. But, to try and be helpful here, that two yellow T-5Rs have gone up for sale with ambitious pricing, suggests that the market is moving. Of course, the dealers won't get these prices, but we know that the Autotrader one was bought somewhere near £15K since it was advertised for that a few months back.

The problem is, unlike other cars, if you really want a yellow T-5R, there aren't loads to choose from, so if you want to pay significantly less than £25K and don't fancy your bargaining skills with optimistic dealers, you'll need to patient.

If your preferences for condition, number of owners, choice of gearbox, service history etc are quite specific, and you don't want to pay ambitious prices, patience might not deliver your requirements.

Many years ago, I decided I wanted a ratty Porsche 964 to leave on the street and use every day. At that time, values were between £10 - 20K, but climbing. I spent 6 months looking at various cars, and found myself having to adjust my requirements — but not quick enough — to match the changing market. Partly out of impatience on my part, I settled on a low-mileage, pristine example for £17.5K, which was the total opposite of what I set out to buy. Frightened that the mileage I was probably going to put on it (I did more miles in the first week of ownership than the previous owner had added in two years) was going to torpedo its value, I sold it for what I paid for it. Such was the market at that time, the phone never stopped ringing. That car would be worth £55- 60K now.

The question is (as discussed elsewhere) whether yellow Volvos have the capacity to rise to stratospheric prices, like old Porsches — who knows?

There were (and are) many more 964s than yellow T-5Rs, but patience didn't deliver. I'm not a fan of patience.

This is indeed the quandary, the wish list is Gul yellow, manual, and ideally an estate, but a saloon is good too. This of course limits the number of vehicles that will come up to be on par with rocking horse poop! The bit that grates is knowing the Bradford one was for sale at circa £15k and is now suddenly worth £10k more - apparently.

Originally Posted by baggy798

It's in a quandary really. It's not a museum piece with near 200,000 miles and worn interior, and the 15k on maintenance and respray in last 3 years to bring it up to scratch suggests it hasn't led a mollycoddled life.

Yet it's not really special enough to 'only use on weekends'. Not exactly a b road blaster or particularly quick.

So that leaves using it as a daily and telling everyone frequently "yeah mate, this was in the british touring championships, whooped everyone mate".

Nail on the head there Baggy, the history and paperwork suggest an example that has seen some love, the mileage says its been used, and the respray is disappointing, but if it's only to refresh it to a nice standard then fair enough, but ultimately its not one to tuck away, if I took the plunge it would be a daily driver, but sadly the price according to the owner points to a concourse pampered trailer queen - which it isn't.

[Jammin]

Originally Posted by Pupbelly

The bit that grates is knowing the Bradford one was for sale at circa £15k and is now suddenly worth £10k more - apparently.

How much would you offer for it then?

[Pupbelly]

Originally Posted by Jammin

How much would you offer for it then?

For the Bradford one, late teens maybe assuming the Main Dealership who currently has it has given it a full health check. The front bumper still needs a paint job though to make it visually right.

[Richard Volvo T5R]

Originally Posted by Pupbelly

For the Bradford one, late teens maybe assuming the Main Dealership who currently has it has given it a full health check. The front bumper still needs a paint job though to make it visually right.

The dealer selling this is actually very genuine, I’d ask them to remove the cheap “fake wood” inserts on the inside that are none original and sort the bumper. I’m also quite certain they would accept an offer in the late teens from a serious buyer.
One point of note about that car is it’s not an original factory manual, it was auto from the factory and was converted by a previous owner.

On the post re the other £25k car for sale someone mentioned Facebook groups, there is a specific Volvo 850 t5r uk group which has several posts about the cars and lots of enthusiastic owners (1 or 2 idiots too) if you joined the group I’m sure you’ll realise who they are.

Good luck on finding the car you are looking for, I’d suggest finding 1 that’s not immaculate and use daily, parts and repairs are surprisingly reasonable and in my experience are no more expensive than a modern car. I’ve found Volvo dealerships are amazing and still supply 90% of parts for the model.

[JohnM 855 T5R]

One point worth considering is that conversion from Auto to Manual will reduce its value in the true "collectors market". A price premium is always attached to an unmolested "as per factory" car with no modifications. Even the AP brakes, no matter how desirable they may be, aren't worth a jot to the collector. So as to price, just as with any classic car, there are two types of buyer.
There is the enthusiast who just wants to own a yellow T-5R Estate and to whom modifications aren't such a concern. They are also likely to be price conscious.
Then there is the collector looking for their next "garage queen". Condition and originality will be all important and the wallet is deeper.
The latter are far and few between but they are out there.
So, dependent on originality and condition I'd say price for a Estate Gul good 'un probably ranges between £13K and £19K. There are some ratty ones about for less (as Richard will tell you) and of course, an Olive or Black one will go for far less.

BTW, why do you want a manual? If it's performance, make no mistake, the auto is as quick as the manual. Car and Driver magazine, when they originally tested the car got 6.6 secs to 60 (marginally quicker than the manual). Taking my own Auto T-5R as a comparison, it is unquestionably quicker than my old Mk1 Manual C70GT T5 ever was and with the T-5R autobox in sport mode, its a positive hooligan.
Don't listen to people who say the autobox saps power. It's torque that's all important and the torque multiplication from the torque converter way more than compensates for the torque limitation at the flywheel imposed by the ECU. In fact, without the torque limitation, the car is practically undrivable due to huge wheelspin. (There are threads on American Volvo forums where individuals defeated the torque limitation only to find that they had to put it back as the car became unusable, even finding that parking was all but impossible without wheelspin.)

John

[Timmilne]

I agree, I think auto transmissions suit this car — it's not a sports car (Porsche only contributed the Alcantara trim) and so hardly something you're going to be flinging round the Welsh Mountains

[JohnM 855 T5R]

Originally Posted by JohnM 855 T5R

Car and Driver magazine, when they originally tested the car got 6.6 secs to 60 (marginally quicker than the manual). John

Apologies, that should have read 6.7 secs to 60

John

[Pupbelly]

JohnM 855 T5R Thank you for your post, I agree about the Bradford one, and whilst AP brakes etc may be desirable, as you say to the purist its not a reason for any price premium. I wasn't aware until recently it was a converted car and again you are right in that it is no longer original and will harm potentially long term valuations. Neither of the two £25k cars are worthy of being tucked away as an investment based on condition or mileages, but they are just too expensive to be a daily mode of transport.

I had a T5 auto in the late 90's and found that you spent a lot of time on the brakes if driving the car in an enthusiastic manner shall we say on B roads!

Just a case of waiting for the right one to pop up I suppose.

[Timmilne]

Can anyone remember a collection-worthy* example of one of these ever coming up for sale, at any price?

* i.e. a car that's been cherished all its life — low miles, meticulous service history, no mods, etc

These two cars with ambitious prices have been used (six figure mileages, multiple owners) and then partially restored, rather than kept in good condition in the first place.

[JohnM 855 T5R]

Originally Posted by Timmilne

Can anyone remember a collection-worthy* example of one of these ever coming up for sale, at any price?

* i.e. a car that's been cherished all its life — low miles, meticulous service history, no mods, etc

These two cars with ambitious prices have been used (six figure mileages, multiple owners) and then partially restored, rather than kept in good condition in the first place.

Hi Tim, One reputedly sold in the US last year for $46,000 (£33,600 give or take). Gul 855 Auto, 2 owners, 32K miles and factory fresh. Talk about rarer than hens teeth.

Regards
John