M56/M66 clutch and flywheel compatibility

foggyjames · Jan 27th, 2013, 23:53

Howdy folks,

Long story short, I'm going to fit an M66 to my M56-equipped D5. To the uninitiated, that a 5>6 speed swap.

I've been advised by a wise man who has swapped them on petrol models that the standard configuration is M56 flywheel and clutch, but you need to use the M66 CSC.

The box I bought came with a very recent (M66) clutch, so I'm keen to use that if I can. In an ideal world, I would use the following hotch-potch of parts...

New M66 flywheel (allegedly rated to hold more torque than the M56 one)
Used M66 clutch (because I've got a nearly-new one)
New M66 CSC (essential, or so I've been told)

However, I've also been told that the timing pattern on the M66 (i.e. Euro 4) flywheel is not compatible with the Euro 3 engine, although a "small modification" makes it possible. I have no idea what the problem is (wrong pattern? Wrong position? It's a different management system, so it's very plausible), so I don't know how to go about tackling it...! Anyone got a spare, junk, Euro 3 flywheel they'd be willing to donate for research...?

So...questions...

Does anyone know if an M66 (Euro 4) flywheel is compatible with a Euro 3 car?
If it isn't, is an M66 clutch compatible with a Euro 3 flywheel?

I need to work out what I need to buy to make this work, basically. I'm only considering using the M66 clutch because it only has 10k on it. Otherwise, the budget isn't particularly an issue.

cheers

James

rogerb · Jan 30th, 2013, 23:34

What you need is a nice auto.
Chesh will give you £50 for you car , if you haggle.
Other than that ,there is lots of talk of doing the swap , but I have yet to see
any real info on this for a D5.
Good luck.
Speak to you soon.

Regards Roger.
Now T6 powered .

foggyjames · Jan 30th, 2013, 23:58

Thanks Roger...I think

I think I'm going to buy an LUK Euro 3 flywheel and an M66 CSC, and see what it all looks like. I can always sell the E3 flywheel if I decide it's interchangeable when compared with the used E4 one I have, and upgrade to a new LUK E4 one.

cheers

James

Andy · Feb 2nd, 2013, 00:25

Tim might still have the Euro 3 DMF off my D5 from when he fitted the T5 DMF with S60R clutch. It was very knackered though so might have been scraped.

foggyjames · Feb 2nd, 2013, 10:04

Thanks Andy! I've been struggling to get hold of Tim lately, but I'll have another go.

Out of interest, what was your motivation in changing to the T5 DMF, and were any modifications required. If the timing pattern was the same E3 D5 > T5, it bodes well for the E4 D5 flywheel. Volvo have used a 60-2 pattern for years, so it would make sense...I've just heard a rumour that they're not compatible.

cheers

James

S60D5-185 · Feb 2nd, 2013, 10:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by foggyjames

Thanks Andy! I've been struggling to get hold of Tim lately, but I'll have another go.

Out of interest, what was your motivation in changing to the T5 DMF, and were any modifications required. If the timing pattern was the same E3 D5 > T5, it bodes well for the E4 D5 flywheel. Volvo have used a 60-2 pattern for years, so it would make sense...I've just heard a rumour that they're not compatible.

cheers

James

Would Don-Kalmar-Union Tuning know ?

Darryl

Ummi60 · May 5th, 2020, 21:00

Did anything come of this project? Im keen to know

foggyjames · May 5th, 2020, 21:45

Yes! It got fitted, back in 2013. The car did another 135k miles in my ownership, then got sold, and did another 93k miles before being scrapped after the engine failed due to a combination of an injector fault, an aggressive remap, and a heavy right foot. It was scrapped on 492k miles - quite a shame!

You need to use the Euro 3 flywheel. I had it on good authority that the patterns are the same (60-2), but differently positioned...so there's no way of doing it, really.

The one side-effect is that the cruise control wouldn't work in 6th gear. The ECU calculates the gear ratio from the road speed (via the ABS) and engine speed...and it knew something was wrong. That is only a bit of code away from being fixed, but I never got around to sorting it out.

cheers

James

bkulcsar · May 6th, 2020, 13:41

Actually you can use an E4 flywheel (on a E3 D5), but you need to do a little modification. See picture attached.

foggyjames · May 10th, 2020, 01:20

How would you go about rotating the pattern? As far as I'm aware, they're machined lumps. I guess you could have the two which need to be removed machined away, and possibly have two replacements machined up and glued on with some epoxy, or similar...?

When I spoke to LUK at the time, they suggested that there was no 'strength' advantage - only the damping characteristics of the springs.

cheers

James

Jan 27th, 2013, 23:53	#1
foggyjames 300 Register Keeper Last Online: Jun 17th, 2024 22:32 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Nottingham	M56/M66 clutch and flywheel compatibility Howdy folks, Long story short, I'm going to fit an M66 to my M56-equipped D5. To the uninitiated, that a 5>6 speed swap. I've been advised by a wise man who has swapped them on petrol models that the standard configuration is M56 flywheel and clutch, but you need to use the M66 CSC. The box I bought came with a very recent (M66) clutch, so I'm keen to use that if I can. In an ideal world, I would use the following hotch-potch of parts... New M66 flywheel (allegedly rated to hold more torque than the M56 one) Used M66 clutch (because I've got a nearly-new one) New M66 CSC (essential, or so I've been told) However, I've also been told that the timing pattern on the M66 (i.e. Euro 4) flywheel is not compatible with the Euro 3 engine, although a "small modification" makes it possible. I have no idea what the problem is (wrong pattern? Wrong position? It's a different management system, so it's very plausible), so I don't know how to go about tackling it...! Anyone got a spare, junk, Euro 3 flywheel they'd be willing to donate for research...? So...questions... Does anyone know if an M66 (Euro 4) flywheel is compatible with a Euro 3 car? If it isn't, is an M66 clutch compatible with a Euro 3 flywheel? I need to work out what I need to buy to make this work, basically. I'm only considering using the M66 clutch because it only has 10k on it. Otherwise, the budget isn't particularly an issue. cheers James __________________ VOC 300-series Register Keeper '13 V70 D4 SE Lux '89 740 Turbo Intercooler '88 360 Turbo Intercooler '84 360 GLT '81 343 GLS R-Sport '79 343 DL '70 164

Jan 30th, 2013, 23:58	#3
foggyjames 300 Register Keeper Last Online: Jun 17th, 2024 22:32 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Nottingham	Thanks Roger...I think I think I'm going to buy an LUK Euro 3 flywheel and an M66 CSC, and see what it all looks like. I can always sell the E3 flywheel if I decide it's interchangeable when compared with the used E4 one I have, and upgrade to a new LUK E4 one. cheers James __________________ VOC 300-series Register Keeper '13 V70 D4 SE Lux '89 740 Turbo Intercooler '88 360 Turbo Intercooler '84 360 GLT '81 343 GLS R-Sport '79 343 DL '70 164

Feb 2nd, 2013, 10:04	#5
foggyjames 300 Register Keeper Last Online: Jun 17th, 2024 22:32 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Nottingham	Thanks Andy! I've been struggling to get hold of Tim lately, but I'll have another go. Out of interest, what was your motivation in changing to the T5 DMF, and were any modifications required. If the timing pattern was the same E3 D5 > T5, it bodes well for the E4 D5 flywheel. Volvo have used a 60-2 pattern for years, so it would make sense...I've just heard a rumour that they're not compatible. cheers James __________________ VOC 300-series Register Keeper '13 V70 D4 SE Lux '89 740 Turbo Intercooler '88 360 Turbo Intercooler '84 360 GLT '81 343 GLS R-Sport '79 343 DL '70 164

May 5th, 2020, 21:45	#8
foggyjames 300 Register Keeper Last Online: Jun 17th, 2024 22:32 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Nottingham	Yes! It got fitted, back in 2013. The car did another 135k miles in my ownership, then got sold, and did another 93k miles before being scrapped after the engine failed due to a combination of an injector fault, an aggressive remap, and a heavy right foot. It was scrapped on 492k miles - quite a shame! You need to use the Euro 3 flywheel. I had it on good authority that the patterns are the same (60-2), but differently positioned...so there's no way of doing it, really. The one side-effect is that the cruise control wouldn't work in 6th gear. The ECU calculates the gear ratio from the road speed (via the ABS) and engine speed...and it knew something was wrong. That is only a bit of code away from being fixed, but I never got around to sorting it out. cheers James __________________ VOC 300-series Register Keeper '13 V70 D4 SE Lux '89 740 Turbo Intercooler '88 360 Turbo Intercooler '84 360 GLT '81 343 GLS R-Sport '79 343 DL '70 164

May 10th, 2020, 01:20	#10
foggyjames 300 Register Keeper Last Online: Jun 17th, 2024 22:32 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Nottingham	How would you go about rotating the pattern? As far as I'm aware, they're machined lumps. I guess you could have the two which need to be removed machined away, and possibly have two replacements machined up and glued on with some epoxy, or similar...? When I spoke to LUK at the time, they suggested that there was no 'strength' advantage - only the damping characteristics of the springs. cheers James __________________ VOC 300-series Register Keeper '13 V70 D4 SE Lux '89 740 Turbo Intercooler '88 360 Turbo Intercooler '84 360 GLT '81 343 GLS R-Sport '79 343 DL '70 164

Jan 30th, 2013, 23:34	#2
rogerb Lets take it to bits Last Online: Apr 23rd, 2023 09:01 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Near Wellingborough	What you need is a nice auto. Chesh will give you £50 for you car , if you haggle. Other than that ,there is lots of talk of doing the swap , but I have yet to see any real info on this for a D5. Good luck. Speak to you soon. Regards Roger. Now T6 powered .

Feb 2nd, 2013, 00:25	#4
Andy Master Member Last Online: Mar 12th, 2023 14:04 Join Date: Jan 1970 Location: Bath/Bristol/N. Wilts	Tim might still have the Euro 3 DMF off my D5 from when he fitted the T5 DMF with S60R clutch. It was very knackered though so might have been scraped.

May 5th, 2020, 21:00	#7
Ummi60 New Member Last Online: Jun 21st, 2020 02:45 Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Virtsu	Did anything come of this project? Im keen to know

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