General: 70: Volvo Car UK Policy on ETM Replacement

[roadhog]

I spoke to them a couple of months ago and was told they do not refurb Volvo ETM anymore due to software problems. Didn't sound like they're planning to in the near future either.

[savanaman]

Hey Wardair,

Great, do you have anything to share with us?

By the way, I remember Wardair, what ever happened to them I flew a few times as a youngster. What connection do you have with them?

[cookie]

I rang them about 3 weeks ago and they gave me the impression that they would rework, perhaps they mis-understood my question but I was specific as I even asked about garage listed on their web site which is in same road on industrial estate.

ben

[1999s70]

I've read through this thread and all I can say, first off, is that I'm so sorry that Volvo is treating non-US car owners like they have been. Do understand, though, that the clincher in the US legal case was that a failing ETM would cause exhaust emissions that would violate California's Clean Air Standards. So - the ETM issue was, effectively, treated as a pollution problem, not a safety/part failure issue. Bottom line - the ETM gets replaced at Volvo's cost if it fails (10 yr/200K limits), but for the wrong reasons.

That said - I've had mine replaced twice - the original lasted 118K and the second 96K. I have almost 40K on my third. I paid for both replacements, but was ultimately reimbursed by Volvo for my first one, coincidentally about 2 months before the second ETM failed. As a member of the Volvo Club of America, I get a 10% discount on parts at my local Volvo dealership, which helped a little when the second ETM had to be replaced - the ETM parts themselves are almost $500, so 10% is something, at least.

As for the software upgrade - since the ETM software has to be reflashed whenever the ETM module is replaced (which, I believe, is why you must go to a dealer to have this service done), even though I was well beyond the 200K limitation on the upgrade, I ended up having it done with my second ETM replacement. My understanding is that the upgrade has to do with the throttle being better able to detect when it "really" has to move the throttle plate, rather than moving it because of a momentary glitch, especially at low engine speeds. Perhaps the theory behind this is that, if the throttle plate moves less, then the ETM will last longer? Only time will tell - I'll see if, and when, I have my third replacement, how long this ETM lasted.

Obviously I can't look inside the throttle body and see what's going on - but I can say that the idle speed is between 25 and 50 rpm higher than before. I can also say that my idle fuel consumption is a bit higher than before - my highway gas mileage has remained the same (or even gone up very slightly), but my "city" driving mileage is a little lower than before.

Hope this helps a little. And, again, I'm sorry that my fellow non-US Volvo owners are being treated shabbily by Volvo.

I am pleased to advise that Watchdog will revisit the ETM issue on Tuesday evening (7pm BBC1). Their researcher is keen to get as many inputs as possible.
Below is a quick summary of inputs to this thread. Please add to the list or edit if I have got it wrong. This is our chance to get VCUK to take notice so the more inputs the better. If you do not want to post please email me whatever you have to wardair@breathe.com

Nickname Vehicle YoM & Mileage Action & Comments VCUK Contribution
Siamblue V70R ETM Cleaned at 80K miles now offered 30%
Addyman ? T5 Replaced under warranty (cost £580) 100%
ollieoxford C70T5 69K Replaced under warranty 100%
lovebuthatem V702.4T 2000 112K
setjett5 V70T6 1999 Replaced paid £635 0%
gjb71 ? T5 2001 94K Replaced 20%
maxheavy S602.0T 2002 65K Replaced cost £930 20%
Tilda99 V70 2000 50K+ Replaced VCUK matched Dealer 20%
limh30 V70 2001 Cleaned Dec 2005
V70driver V70 promised letter from VCUK (still waiting)
cookie V70 T5 1999 117,000 Idle is erratic.

Wardair

[Oli]

Oli, V plate V70 R AWD (2000 MY), erratic idle on an intermittent basis from 60,000 miles (when car purchased). Reported to dealer many times, but never a code to read when checked. At 78,000 miles service (90,000 mile service carried out) software for the ETM was upgraded (but without a discussion about why or the benefits of doing so - but we all know why don't we). Now at 90,000 miles and I still have erratic idle, and just last week it was so up and down that the car stalled. Have reported again. As it was first reported (several times) during the dealer warranty period I'll be arguing for the cost to be fully covered if it does need replacing, as clearly they knew what the problem was, but were avoiding the real fix required.

And somebody else posted that they were offerd a lifetime guarantee on their replacement. Afterall, the problem is being fixed with a unit that is exactly the same and therefore will fail again. We need a redesigned unit that will not fail. What's the ETM in the newer models (like the C70 post 2002 that is not part of the "at risk" group)?

Are you going on Watchdog?

Oli

Thanks Oli I have added your info to the list below. I was asked to appear on the show but due to work commitments I could not


Nickname Vehicle YoM & Mileage Action & Comments VCUK Contribution
Siamblue V70R ETM Cleaned at 80K miles now offered 30%
Addyman ? T5 Replaced under warranty (cost £580) 100%
ollieoxford C70T5 69K Replaced under warranty 100%
lovebuthatem V702.4T 2000 112K
setjett5 V70T6 1999 Replaced paid £635 0%
gjb71 ? T5 2001 94K Replaced 20%
maxheavy S602.0T 2002 65K Replaced cost £930 20%
Tilda99 V70 2000 50K+ Replaced VCUK matched Dealer 20%
limh30 V70 2001 Cleaned Dec 2005
V70driver V70 promised letter from VCUK (still waiting)
cookie V70 T5 1999 117,000 Idle is erratic.
oli V70 R AWD (2000 MY) 90,000 erratic idle since 60K New software @ 90K


Wardair

One more vehicle details added. please keep the inputs coming :-


Nickname Vehicle YoM & Mileage Action & Comments VCUK Contribution
Siamblue V70R ETM Cleaned at 80K miles now offered 30%
Addyman ? T5 Replaced under warranty (cost £580) 100%
ollieoxford C70T5 69K Replaced under warranty 100%
lovebuthatem V70 2.4T 2000 112K worried about failure?
setjett5 V70T6 1999 Replaced paid £635 0%
gjb71 ? T5 2001 94K Replaced 20%
maxheavy S602.0T 2002 65K Replaced cost £930 20%
Tilda99 V70 2000 50K+ Replaced VCUK matched Dealer 20%
limh30 V70 2001 Cleaned Dec 2005
V70driver V70 promised letter from VCUK (still waiting)
cookie V70 T5 1999 117,000 Idle is erratic.
oli V70 R AWD (2000 MY) 90,000 erratic idle since 60K New software @ 90K
Volvo2 V70 2002 ?mileage ETM cleaned and software upgraded Sept 06 now has irratic idle

Wardair [wardair@breathe.com]

[cookie]

Mine is in 2morrow (sorry later today) monday to local mech to replace lambda sensors as engine light is on. will post out come as was considering speaking to local maindealer re idle but would be very wary about them doing any work unless they g'tee to return car fully working without charge. I do not want a 'free reprogram of throttle clean' to be then advised 'sorry broke part removing so cannot drive till replaced £600 please', I have read and heard of such expiriences

Ben

[Oli]

Originally Posted by cookie

Mine is in 2morrow (sorry later today) monday to local mech to replace lambda sensors as engine light is on. will post out come as was considering speaking to local maindealer re idle but would be very wary about them doing any work unless they g'tee to return car fully working without charge. I do not want a 'free reprogram of throttle clean' to be then advised 'sorry broke part removing so cannot drive till replaced £600 please', I have read and heard of such expiriences

Ben

Ben, It's not the ETM that's removed for cleaning, this is a sealed unit. The throttle body gets cleaned out, which is a standard service item anyway every so often.

It's a bit late, but how did you decide that the lambda sensor needed replacing, is your local mech able to check the codes and diagnose correctly?

Oli