Geartronic vs. DCT - experiences?

[pont]

Hi all,

Being in the market for a new xc40, and only recently learning that they are now 7 speed dct, I am wondering how owners are getting on with them.

I had an early ish 2007 vw dsg which was good but jerky at low speeds, and vw had a lot of issues back in the early days.

I have no idea who makes the volvo dct, or if they are proving problematic. The xc60 is staying with the 8 speed ainsin torque converter afaik, which says a lot.

Having had many superb volvos with wonderful auto boxes, I am reluctant to change to a dct unless they are proving to be reliable.

Has anyone got a high miles xc40 dct?

Thanks

[Haldex]

Nearing 40K in under 2 yrs now on my XC40 with a DCT - no issues whatsoever. I am unaware of any problems with DCT reported on this forum or other Volvo forums I frequent.

Unlike my previous XC60 with the Aisin t/c, its performance is constant - no need for "switch to AWD and drive past 40km/h" to reset the transmission learning every so often. No hesitation, no jerks - just blazing quick shifts in every situation. What I miss though is the shift pedals - which Volvo discontinued on all models - and would really be useful on a DCT.

[neilgorin]

I have the DCT with the V60 B3 mild hybrid petrol.

I've only done just under 10000 miles in it so far (was new in June) but largely don't have any issues except the noise (below).

The only thing is it is inclined to spin the front wheels if you are in slow traffic and put your foot down, partly due to the electric motor giving boost and partly due to the woeful Michelin tyres Volvo have put on it. There is certainly no turbo lag at all due to the motor and the fuel consumption if driven gently or using the speed limiter on the motorway is within 5% of my old D4 manual so quite happy with that. If you use the cruise control though it knocks around 10% off the MPG every single time.

I am very wary how well it will wear though. I've never bothered with extended warranties on cars, but this one will either be extended just before 60k or traded in at that point. The gearbox is a Chinese Geely unit, if you dig enough you can find quite a lot of failures on earlier versions of the box in the Chinese market, and of course the manufacturers always claim to have fixed that - but like all things, you can never tell until you try it.

To drive it feels like a conventional auto though, it doesn't do the very abrupt changes that the VW boxes do, it sort of slurs things slightly.

The only real issue with the DCT is detailed extensively on the XC40 forums, but also applies to the V60 with it. When you lift off the throttle, under the right circumstances, the engine goes off, coming back on again the moment you touch the throttle. Thing is, this stops the oil pump in the gear box - so the gear change is operating on residual pressure. If you coast for a fair distance and then press the brake, the gearbox decides to drop into a lower gear to be ready to pull away. As the pressure has dropped, this sometimes causes a rushing noise from the gearbox - either a "whoop" or in some situations a noise like you've gone over a rumble strip. "They all do it, Sir". I have got into the habit of just ever so slightly tapping the throttle pedal before braking, as it never does it if the engine is running as the pressures are all up.

[Simmy]

Originally Posted by neilgorin

I have the DCT with the V60 B3 mild hybrid petrol.

I've only done just under 10000 miles in it so far (was new in June) but largely don't have any issues except the noise (below).

The only thing is it is inclined to spin the front wheels if you are in slow traffic and put your foot down, partly due to the electric motor giving boost and partly due to the woeful Michelin tyres Volvo have put on it. There is certainly no turbo lag at all due to the motor and the fuel consumption if driven gently or using the speed limiter on the motorway is within 5% of my old D4 manual so quite happy with that. If you use the cruise control though it knocks around 10% off the MPG every single time.

I am very wary how well it will wear though. I've never bothered with extended warranties on cars, but this one will either be extended just before 60k or traded in at that point. The gearbox is a Chinese Geely unit, if you dig enough you can find quite a lot of failures on earlier versions of the box in the Chinese market, and of course the manufacturers always claim to have fixed that - but like all things, you can never tell until you try it.

To drive it feels like a conventional auto though, it doesn't do the very abrupt changes that the VW boxes do, it sort of slurs things slightly.

The only real issue with the DCT is detailed extensively on the XC40 forums, but also applies to the V60 with it. When you lift off the throttle, under the right circumstances, the engine goes off, coming back on again the moment you touch the throttle. Thing is, this stops the oil pump in the gear box - so the gear change is operating on residual pressure. If you coast for a fair distance and then press the brake, the gearbox decides to drop into a lower gear to be ready to pull away. As the pressure has dropped, this sometimes causes a rushing noise from the gearbox - either a "whoop" or in some situations a noise like you've gone over a rumble strip. "They all do it, Sir". I have got into the habit of just ever so slightly tapping the throttle pedal before braking, as it never does it if the engine is running as the pressures are all up.

i have both not really much difference neither like to be pushed hard they soon complain but both cars do the job car 1 geartronic 246k car2 dct130k so fairly reliable.

[Haldex]

Originally Posted by neilgorin

The gearbox is a Chinese Geely unit, if you dig enough you can find quite a lot of failures on earlier versions of the box in the Chinese market, and of course the manufacturers always claim to have fixed that - but like all things, you can never tell until you try it.

Actually no- the 7-DCT EVO was developed by Volvo, co-developed (read "financed"..) by Geely but it has been adopted on Geely models only recently. It's first application was on several Proton models (so not Chinese market..) and then Volvo/Lynk&Co mild hybrids. I have never stumbled upon any complaints of inherent issues on Proton (or other brands..) with this tranny. But do share, if you know more.

Originally Posted by neilgorin

When you lift off the throttle, under the right circumstances, the engine goes off, coming back on again the moment you touch the throttle. Thing is, this stops the oil pump in the gear box - so the gear change is operating on residual pressure. If you coast for a fair distance and then press the brake, the gearbox decides to drop into a lower gear to be ready to pull away. As the pressure has dropped, this sometimes causes a rushing noise from the gearbox - either a "whoop" or in some situations a noise like you've gone over a rumble strip.

Can't say that I've ever experienced this phenomenon in near 40K miles. Neither i have read of it on this forum or swedespeed..

[stupe93]

I came the opposite way, Skoda DSG to xc90 (2019 diesel) and find the Volvo box terrible, esp 1st/2nd gear where there is lots of "slip" going up and down the gears, the dealer says its normal and I have driven another which is similar but maybe not as pronounced, do they all do this or should I press the dealer some more??

[neilgorin]

Originally Posted by Haldex

Can't say that I've ever experienced this phenomenon in near 40K miles. Neither i have read of it on this forum or swedespeed..

Air con off. Radio off. Engine off coast for a mile or so and then touch the brakes.

It's a common issue and caused by oil surge through the hydraulics:

Two of the many threads here:
https://www.xc40forums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=3681 (see post JFDIT » Sat Jul 29, 2023)

and here:

https://www.xc40forums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=3580 (see post gaughey » Sun Jul 02, 2023)

Doesn't happen on the earlier B3/B4 with the 8 speed transmission, only on the 7 speed DCT when fitted with the mild hybrid and only when braking after coasting, and only then occasionally. Very few reports of it on the V60 simply because there are so few V60 or S60 with this combination - far more of them are earlier with the 8 speed which just drops the revs rather than switching off.

Ref the gearbox, I had indeed read it was based on the Geely unit when it was first introduced - that may well be wrong, I'm not a journalist. Trouble with any gearbox or engine is that until people have used them in the real world for 100000 miles minimum, real issues aren't reported. For example, no one had an issue with the Ford Powershift that Volvo fitted to the 1.6 diesel on the previous generation V60 or V70 initially, but it's a nightmare as it ages - to such an extent that Ford were forced to buy back large numbers of vehicles in the US.

[Haldex]

Thanks for the links to discussions. However, no one there is referencing an oil surge as the cause. I would be inclined to say that it could be down to the belt - as one of the forumers suggested. Ie. not quite gearbox-related. But time will tell, for sure.

I agree that any potential problems will show with time/real-world usage. This applies to any new product. It is comforting though that this gearbox was used for 2-3 yrs on Proton models - so it did see quite some real-world usage before being implemented on Volvo platforms.

For longevity/durability - certainly t/c automatics are a better choice, no doubt about it - but same applies to any part of these cars. A non-turbo, large-displacement V6 would easily outlive any 3/4 cyl turbocharged/supercharged/hybridized plant - but those aren’t available any more..