Help! Electrical Gremlin; Indicators

[Johnny64]

Originally Posted by hreg240

Hi Johnny,

I'm glad the thread has helped you somewhat!

If you've checked the fuses for 9 and 13, check the fuse 5. It is a 16a with blue wires connecting to it. This is the fuse that went on mine and I was perplexed as nowhere I read referenced this as one to check.

Make sure to physically remove the fuse from the housing and inspect it; mine looked fine in situ but had a bad connection on one end.

Also, check that the two 'prongs' connecting the fuse in place are actually holding it snugly. If these are loose, the connection won't be great.

If it is something that has suddenly happened, I would err on the thought that it is a fuse of connection. Water is known to get into the fuse box on these 240s. Check everything for dampness and clean and dry if necessary.

Let us know how you get on!

-Thorne

P.S - If fuse 5 isn't the culprit, and there isn't a short / dampness in the fuse box, like Alan said: be methodical.

That's the approach I took and we looked at each component in the indicating system until we found a fault - it took about 40 minutes with a multimeter.

The potential weak links are:

• Indicator stalk and corresponding connections behind it

• Hazard switch and its connections

• Indicator relay and its connections (relay is found in passenger footwell behind center console

• Fuses 5, 9 and 13

• The wiring from the bulkhead to the indicators themselves, although I'd say this is unlikely to be at fault, unless a connection has come loose or a wire has frayed

There isn't much in these systems, they are quite simple - even if they tend to not want to work

Thanks Thorne, very much appreciated this thread and as i said above to Alan, Patience and methodical methods will win the day.. but its easy to get in a slight (and unecessary) flap about these things when its your daily transport. A multi-meter is a must and will be in my possession later today! the fuse box and surrounding areas (behind footwells and dashboard are dry as a bone and nice and clean.. i will check through the fuses again when the weather lets up (i have nowhere under cover) and go through the list methodically and will report back

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Johnny64

Thanks Alan, Sage words and absolutely, patience and methodical methods will win the day! I am getting myself a multi-meter today, as soon as i can get out of a flooded and gale swept bit of Exmoor.. I have a 93 (K reg) torslanda which has the 'in french' circuit details on the the fuse cover and its a bit different to yours (the foglights are on the same circuit as the indicators and seatbelt (fuse 12) and the Hazards are on fuse 9. once i have the multi-meter and the deluge lets up i will be back out there and will report back

Originally Posted by Johnny64

Thanks Thorne, very much appreciated this thread and as i said above to Alan, Patience and methodical methods will win the day.. but its easy to get in a slight (and unecessary) flap about these things when its your daily transport. A multi-meter is a must and will be in my possession later today! the fuse box and surrounding areas (behind footwells and dashboard are dry as a bone and nice and clean.. i will check through the fuses again when the weather lets up (i have nowhere under cover) and go through the list methodically and will report back

In than case it may be worth pulling first fuse 12 (see what doesn't work - especially the fog lamps) and then fuse 9 to see if anything changes (if anything else stops working). If that doesn't eliminate anything I'd suggest checking the output side of all the fuses to see if they have 12v - the issue may be an unintended consequence of another fuse (like #5 on Thorne's motor car) having blown or being poorly seated.

Once you have a test meter this shouldn't take long to sort - and you will find your shiny new meter will come in handy often with a 30 year old Volvo.

[hreg240]

Originally Posted by Johnny64

Thanks Thorne, very much appreciated this thread and as i said above to Alan, Patience and methodical methods will win the day.. but its easy to get in a slight (and unecessary) flap about these things when its your daily transport. A multi-meter is a must and will be in my possession later today! the fuse box and surrounding areas (behind footwells and dashboard are dry as a bone and nice and clean.. i will check through the fuses again when the weather lets up (i have nowhere under cover) and go through the list methodically and will report back

Sounds very similar to my situation. My 240 is my daily transport as well; I have a H reg '90 estate (if you hadn't guessed lol).

My fuse box cover is also in french, which I have no clue why they did that.

The best advice I can give is to double check those fuses (are you sure it's 12 and not 13? there could be differences between 1990 and '93, but I don't know). Good to hear that the area is dry and clean - that helps eliminate that issue.

Keep us updated.

P.S - it is common to get into a flap over these things, goodness knows I did. Being a chronic overthinker doesn't help! Just try to remain calm, no matter how difficult that is in practice.

[hreg240]

Another thing to note, Johnny, check to make sure that the correct fuses are being used. I had a 16a in place of (what should've been) an 8a on fuse 9. This didn't cause the problem, but was certainly providing more resistance than the relay was liking, as when I replaced it with an 8a, the relay started making its 'click' noise properly.

[Johnny64]

Hi and thanks so much to you both: An update and success (of sorts..); A friend with a multi-meter came to my rescue this afternoon (a friend with multi-meter is a friend indeed) and between showers we went through the fuses (all correct) and connections in the fuse box.. all fine. The 'relevant' fuses turned out to be 5 (indicators), 9 (hazards) and 12 (seat belt warning plus rear window heater and foglamps)!!. Then we went on to testing the hazard warning switch and found there was a loose connection. When it was pushed on firmly, it didnt make any difference but when it was taken off everything started working!! the switch had two pins in one block and this separate 'flat' pin/connector to one side- that was the one that seemed to be the problem! We checked everything else was working ok which it was so the problem SEEMS to be solved though it would be interesting to hear any thoughts.. at this point i'm just quite pleased i can get to work tomorrow and pick up my multi-meter from my local 'auto factors'!

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Johnny64

Hi and thanks so much to you both: An update and success (of sorts..); A friend with a multi-meter came to my rescue this afternoon (a friend with multi-meter is a friend indeed) and between showers we went through the fuses (all correct) and connections in the fuse box.. all fine. The 'relevant' fuses turned out to be 5 (indicators), 9 (hazards) and 12 (seat belt warning plus rear window heater and foglamps)!!. Then we went on to testing the hazard warning switch and found there was a loose connection. When it was pushed on firmly, it didnt make any difference but when it was taken off everything started working!! the switch had two pins in one block and this separate 'flat' pin/connector to one side- that was the one that seemed to be the problem! We checked everything else was working ok which it was so the problem SEEMS to be solved though it would be interesting to hear any thoughts.. at this point i'm just quite pleased i can get to work tomorrow and pick up my multi-meter from my local 'auto factors'!

First of all well done for fixing the issue.

So, if I understand you correctly, you have disconnected a single wire connector from the hazard switch and now everything works correctly, including the hazards, in all conditions (ignition on and off, seat belts fitted and not, indicators working both sides, fog lamps on and off etc), is that correct? It is unlikely that anyone here will recognise the wire you have disconnected from your description, so was at a live or an earth? Was it switched by anything else? What colour was the wire's insulation?

It is sort of unlikely that a wire and connector fitted by Mr Volvo can have been disconnected with no outcome, so make absolutely sure everything really is working properly. If everything really is working properly with a spurious conductor disconnected then you could just tape it out of the way and leave everything as it is. If it isn't quite right, or you are curious as to what it could be, then it shouldn't take long to identify it from its colour and whether it is live or earth on the wiring diagram. If it was me I'd work out what the spurious conductor does and decide whether it needed to be fixed properly.

[Johnny64]

Hmm yes.. i hope i didnt sound a bit glib as if 'problem sorted, not going to think about it anymore'.. because you are absolutely right and ive been scratching my chin and thinking about why this might be so. The insulation on the wire was black (i'm pretty sure) and im not actually happy with this result as it presents more questions than answers.. But everything else appears to work, having checked through all functions twice. Im going to study the relevant wiring diagram and will go back to have another look tomorrow..

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Johnny64

Hmm yes.. i hope i didnt sound a bit glib as if 'problem sorted, not going to think about it anymore'.. because you are absolutely right and ive been scratching my chin and thinking about why this might be so. The insulation on the wire was black (i'm pretty sure) and im not actually happy with this result as it presents more questions than answers.. But everything else appears to work, having checked through all functions twice. Im going to study the relevant wiring diagram and will go back to have another look tomorrow..

I don't have a wiring diagram for anything as late as your motor car, but generally solid black is used for chassis earths. The only likely chassis earth to the hazard switch would (probably) be for the illumination bulb - so does the switch still light up when flashing? If not that would make some sense - if the tell-tale bulb inside the switch wasn't connected (to chassis earth) then everything else would probably work - but if the earth wire had chaffed through and was touching a live conductor then there might be unintended consequences.

See if the switch lights up when the hazards are operated, if not that may be the cause. If so you could fix it easily by snipping off the connector and running a new line to chassis earth.

Without a cct diagram that is the best I can do

[Bob 1967]

The Haynes last diagram is for 86 to 93 model ?(Manual 0270 cover says 74 to 93)
I had to blow them up on a photocopier to A3 size(Each page was A4) and colour them in with felt tips.
Makes it easier to chase wires(for us with older eyes)
Still a struggle to make sense of them.

[Othen]

Originally Posted by Bob 1967

The Haynes last diagram is for 86 to 93 model ?(Manual 0270 cover says 74 to 93)
I had to blow them up on a photocopier to A3 size(Each page was A4) and colour them in with felt tips.
Makes it easier to chase wires(for us with older eyes)
Still a struggle to make sense of them.

My manual is for 1974 to 88 240s - I've not owned one of the new ones.