Body/Trim: My beloved car saved me - assessors now want to write it off

[readview]

Hi,
if the car is wrtten off,it will become a category "c" insurance loss and you would have to have it re-mot'd and then book a "vic" check at your nearest dvla testing facility,this costs around £41.Not expensive but the wait for the vic check is usually around 3 weeks.I would fight your corner on this,at the end of the day the car is your property and not the insurers so i would consult citizens advice on this as i cannot see how they can write it off without your agreement.The no win no fee people pay kickbacks to insurers of up to £400/case to get the details of accident victims and make a lot of money doing so.I would kick these people into touch completely as if you are awarded anything for personal injury they will take a large slice of it for themselves.It is really not too hard for you to persue a personal injury claim yourself and many policys have this type of advice/cover included withthem anyway.Unless you have signed anyting to allow these vultures to act on your behalf i would instruct them to cease any activity regarding your case.I strongly advise you to get some independent legal advise as soon as possible from someone who is not wanting to sell you their "services".
I you do go down the route of repairing the car we do have all the parts in stock (good used) that you may need.
Adam.

[nickbw898]

Originally Posted by lillia

If the car is written off, do I need to go through certain procedures with the DVLA, etc. to have it be declared safe/road-worthy before I am allowed to drive it? How much is that likely to cost?

Do not worry about this at the moment. There is no mechanical reason and I do not think there is a good case financially, to write the car off. The solicitors need to be dealt with very firmly. Firstly they should have declared an interest straight away and the information they have gained is not in good faith. LV has a reasonable reputation, though like many other insurer's this has been going south in the last two years. Chris Knott is a good broker especially for non-standard cover ie cars which have been modified. Back to the solicitors.You did not make it crystal if they are associated with Highway or if you have requested them to act for you. There have been a lot of solicitors 'ambulance chasing' and pushing no win no fee claims in respect of "whiplash" injury. They make a very easy and exorbitant profit this way and they use bullying tactics just a hair this side of legal.There is a big drive to reduce this as it is a major factor in raising insurance costs generally (yes I know insurance is 14% lower just now). Having been through a four year divorce six years ago I can tell you that you need to be very firm with solicitors and make it clear you will stand your ground, otherwise sack them. My ex wife now (six years after the fact) agrees with me on this, her solicitors charged her £10,000 and did nothing much and gave some shockingly bad advise!
My last advise is do things by fax you then have an indisputable proof of what was said/agreed and since you used a broker get though to them and make it clear you are not happy with the way things are looking. Keep it simple (don't get into a blow by blow account) say you do not have faith in the solicitor and that if "he" wants future business from you (and your friends/familly) he needs to have a conversation with Highway ASAP.
http://www.reviewcentre.com/reviews123836.html
http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=95725
http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=95725
These links are the firat three brought up by google search for H's reputation. Sorry this has to be painful reading but I would not go near them. One has to wonder why CK is dealing with them!
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-new...s-2013-to-2014
Keep calm and carry on.

[lillia]

Hi, thank you for the comments and recommendations.

The broker is Chris Knott and you are correct in that they do tend to give good service. Which is why I was shocked to find that I was talking to a no-win-no-fee company "acting on behalf of Chris Knott" when I called to report the accident. Naïve of me, but I had assumed that when I called the accident number they gave me on the key ring and pressed 1, I would be passed on to someone in Chris Knott who would pass me on to the insurance company. Apologies if I was not clear, I came into contact with the solicitors via Chris Knott, not via Highway (LV). And the thrust of their questions was not so much about the incident, but about me. I kept asking when they were going to take the other driver's details from me and she just kept asking me more questions about me: profession, etc. When she asked to play a legal message and I heard the words no-win-no-fee and personal injury that is when I finally had to ask "who are you and who do you represent?"

Highway/LV have been great so far. I had never heard of them before Chris Knott recommended them. Chris Knott had attempted to increase my premium and I threatened to leave, found lower quotes elsewhere and then they miraculously were able to give me a lower rate. I had to drive 14 miles or so to the garage/assessor's that Highway recommended, but having been there and met the manager and the staff and seen the no-nonsense way in which the gentleman went about doing the assessment, my mind was set at ease. Honestly, I had expected the estimate for the damage to be in the write-off league as well since he was recommended by the insurers. However, he explained each step of what needed to be done and how it would be done and why the costs were what they were. He did not treat me like a nincompoop for asking lots of questions. By the time I had arrived home and contacted the insurance company, Highway had already received the estimate and the detailed photographs of the damage. The lady I spoke with said that from the low cost, she fully expects that the engineers will approve the repairs once they have looked at the photos and what needs to be done. I should know what they decide within 2-3 days. She said that it is sometimes quicker, but they usually tell customers 2-3 days to be on the safe side. So we shall see! Fingers crossed.

Regarding a previous question, I have not signed anything with the solicitors, but I did say on the phone that having realised that the no-win-no-fee company were not my insurance company, I wished to contact my insurance company first and foremost to see what their position would be on the damage and have them handle that claim. I told her that although she had explained a lot and played that message, I did not understand much of it and would contact Highway to see what they had to say. The no-win lady said that was fine, it just meant that they would handle the personal injury side of the claim. She said she would send something for me to sign (I assumed that it would come by post) and that I should read it and sign it. It turns out (I have seen this today) that they sent me an e-mail to click on a link and sign, which I have not done, because I had more questions than answers after having read it. From this latest lady's reaction about the no-write-off decision, I presume they will want to claim for "costs" incurred as a result of having sent out an assessor to look at the car. But they were supposed to be looking at injuries, which is what I presume the visit was about. The chap called up 5 mins before the first visit was due to take place to say he was 47 mins away. I had a meeting so had to reschedule. He arrived the following morning, took around four photos and left after a grand total of 5 minutes; he has overestimated the cost of repairs, missed the underarch damage and underestimated the value of the car. Not good at all.

I have now received three estimates for repairing the car: one astronomical, one mid-range and one really low one, which makes me wonder just what kind of repair would be done for that price. The mid-range one is recommended by the insurer and this garage has stated that they will use original Volvo parts, right down to the paint mix.

[nickbw898]

Good news then! Thanks for the detail. If you are intending to keep the car for some years then go with the insurer's choice. A decent insurer undewriter takes five minutes to make a decision given photos from the assesor.
You have no obligation to the no-win firm. Be very firm and blunt, polite but definitive. Their business model is unethical and should have no place in English Law!

Is your no claims "protected"? Look into what the ins and outs of this are, and the impact of this claim on your future ncb. Also remember insurers do not reward loyalty, shop around for quotes every year using the moneysavingexpert order:
Money Supermarket
GoCompare
Confused
Compare the Market

My experience in recent weeks is the same insurer, car and cover yeilds different quotes accross the comparison site range and offer different combinations of "bolt ons" and included options. Lastly, look up the best quoted deals on the Auto Express Llist there is frquent dramatic movement in performance and one may rely on this information as it is from a statistically significant number of policy holders and their opinions: from the horses mouth, so to speak. This is only one source/opinion about ncb but a good start.http://www.confused.com/car-insuranc...onus-explained

[lillia]

Thank you, yes - my no claims bonus is protected. Apparently it will remain protected provided I make no more than 2 claims within a 5-year period (fairly certain the person who sold me the policy said within a 4-year period, but I'm not complaining).

Update: I have returned home early with a splitting headache and received two telephone calls.

The first one was a half-hour discussion with regards to liability as my insurance company has finally got in touch with the other driver's insurance company and they are now moving to discuss liability. Apparently the other company has not yet begun to do anything, so mine is making sure that they've got everything to hand to be extra prepared, just in case it becomes protracted, because this could be "complicated". I had to go on google maps and look at the road and walk the caller through the incident, etc., and make it once again clear that the accident was in no way my fault. They are sending me charts and stuff by post - they no longer really use these, he said, but some insurers still do, so it's good to have them on record.

The second call was from the garage recommended by the insurance company, to say that they have received the approval of the cost of repairs and are contacting me to schedule a time for the car to be taken in for the work to be done. They are very very busy at the moment (40-50 cars in the pipeline), but they have booked me in for the 11th of August. A bit far ahead (I was prepared to take it to them in the morning!) but again, I am not complaining. Four days to do the job. I've put on my prettiest phone smile and the gentleman said that if they get a cancellation then they'll give me a call to take the car in sooner. I'll discuss having them look at the couple of (light) bird dropping etchings on the bonnet and doing the MOT at the same time. And then I'll invest in a car cover because these seagulls show no mercy when they splatter all over a person's car - and always right after it has been washed!

So good news on the repair front, quick decision. I'm going to have a large cup of cocoa with cinnamon. Only remains now to see what the solicitors and their reps who have left messages while I was at work have to say/do from here on. I've made copious notes from your messages so as to know exactly what to say and do should there be any problems.

Thank you all for the advice and support, you have helped to keep me sane at this crazy time. I'll let you know how things turn out!

[RAN60]

Still being a bit sore from my experience just wanted to voice my discuss at the insurance industry.

Long story short, i was hit, driver admitted liability straight off. Car was repaired, no claims bonus is protected (like yours, unless i have 2 incidents in 3 years) but..........

Your premiums will go up next year, regardless of fault, and this goes for all insurers. It ridiculous and sickening. The explanation i had was "because you have been involved in an incident you are classed as being at a higher risk".

I explained that there was no question of fault or liability and i was just driving normal when a car hit me, the reply was "your still seen as more of a risk"!

So apparently when you car gets hit by another it then becomes magnatised to all other cars slightly more than before the incident!!

I hope you are ok and all goes well with the claim but prepare yourself at renewal time!!

[charles p]

I had a very similar shunt in a 55 plate V70. A Rover 214 t-boned me in East London when not looking. The Rover was written off. The Volvo drove home (brand reassurance)

After an insurance repair I wore out rear tyres in 3,000 miles because the bodyshop didn't get Volvo rear suspension

Charles

[Dirty Rooster]

The more everyone understands and remembers this, the better ;

Originally Posted by Brendan W

In spite of their earnest assurances, insurance and legals are not there to protect you.

[nickbw898]

Lillia It seems to me you treated the situation correctly as the good practice guidance (govt website using the road/ roundabouts 184 - 190) " At double mini-roundabouts treat each roundabout separately and give way to traffic from the right." I am assuming the other party came from ahead of you and you turned away reflexively to avoid them, hence you were hit in the rear. Many people drive as if mini roundabouts simply are not there, which is contrary to use of the road and it is a great pity you had no passer by able to give witness. You would have a watertight case as to 'fault'.

I used to be responsible for new cars stored at our dealership, bird droppings were a problem even on new cars still in storage wax from the manufacturer. This especially so in hot sunny weather. I used to get the valeting department to jet wash them asap but only the 'just splattered' came out unscathed. The following explanation will help you understand and remember, thanks to environmentalism and elf and safety, modern car paint is water based and much less protective!
New research from Autoglym, the UK's leading car care experts, suggests that the familiar sight of car bodywork 'etched' by bird droppings are not the result of any corrosive property in the deposit, as is commonly believed. In fact, damage instead results from the paint lacquer contracting upon cooling and moulding to the uneven texture of the hardened deposit.

As paint lacquer warms – in the direct summer sunshine for example – it softens and expands. At the same time, that heat dries and hardens any bird droppings on the surface. Autoglym's researchers discovered that as the paint lacquer cools, overnight for example, it contracts, hardens and moulds around the texture of the bird dropping. To the naked eye, this moulding at a microscopic level appears as dulled or etched paintwork. The light's reflection is interrupted by the imperfect surface, unlike the undamaged paint surrounding it which gives a clearer reflection.

Autoglym's tests with strongly acidic, neutral and strongly alkali bird dropping substitutes highlighted negligible differences in the damage caused. However, differences in paint damage were noted when the substitute bird deposits had varying degrees of grain-to-liquid content. A grainier texture caused greater light distortion (dullness) when the paint moulded around it.

Wax and polish treatments – that protect against chemical attack from acid raid and UV sun damage, for example – provide limited protection from the paint moulding to bird droppings, although they will make them easier to remove. The longer the deposit remains on the bodywork, and the higher the temperatures, the harder the dried deposit will be, and the greater the propensity for the paint lacquer to mould to it as it cools. Bird dropping damage can only be prevented by motorists remaining vigilant and removing the deposit as soon as possible.

Autoglym's has outlined some tips for minimising the risk of damage from bird droppings:

- Remove the deposit at the earliest opportunity

- Motorists should use a moist cloth – Autoglym's Bird Dropping Wipes are ideal – to gently lift the deposit from the surface

- If the deposit is dry or doesn't lift easily, place a moist cloth over it for ten minutes to soften the deposit

- Dispose of any cloth or wipe used to remove bird droppings immediately and carefully wash your hands, as bird lime can harbour diseases

Paul Caller, CEO of Autoglym, said: "It's a great shame when an otherwise fabulous-looking car is blighted with a tell-tale patch of dull paint. As a result of this new research by our R&D team in Letchworth, we now understand why bird droppings are a frighteningly potent hazard to bodywork.

"As bird droppings become ever more prevalent through spring and into summer, motorists must be extremely vigilant to avoid permanent damage, especially those who park their cars under trees at home or at work. The only way to prevent the paint becoming noticeably tarnished is to carefully remove deposits as swiftly as possible."
New research from Autoglym, the UK's leading car care experts, suggests that the familiar sight of car bodywork 'etched' by bird droppings are not the result of any corrosive property in the deposit, as is commonly believed. In fact, damage instead results from the paint lacquer contracting upon cooling and moulding to the uneven texture of the hardened deposit.

As paint lacquer warms – in the direct summer sunshine for example – it softens and expands. At the same time, that heat dries and hardens any bird droppings on the surface. Autoglym's researchers discovered that as the paint lacquer cools, overnight for example, it contracts, hardens and moulds around the texture of the bird dropping. To the naked eye, this moulding at a microscopic level appears as dulled or etched paintwork. The light's reflection is interrupted by the imperfect surface, unlike the undamaged paint surrounding it which gives a clearer reflection.

Autoglym's tests with strongly acidic, neutral and strongly alkali bird dropping substitutes highlighted negligible differences in the damage caused. However, differences in paint damage were noted when the substitute bird deposits had varying degrees of grain-to-liquid content. A grainier texture caused greater light distortion (dullness) when the paint moulded around it.

Wax and polish treatments – that protect against chemical attack from acid raid and UV sun damage, for example – provide limited protection from the paint moulding to bird droppings, although they will make them easier to remove. The longer the deposit remains on the bodywork, and the higher the temperatures, the harder the dried deposit will be, and the greater the propensity for the paint lacquer to mould to it as it cools. Bird dropping damage can only be prevented by motorists remaining vigilant and removing the deposit as soon as possible.

Autoglym's has outlined some tips for minimising the risk of damage from bird droppings:

- Remove the deposit at the earliest opportunity

- Motorists should use a moist cloth – Autoglym's Bird Dropping Wipes are ideal – to gently lift the deposit from the surface

- If the deposit is dry or doesn't lift easily, place a moist cloth over it for ten minutes to soften the deposit

- Dispose of any cloth or wipe used to remove bird droppings immediately and carefully wash your hands, as bird lime can harbour diseases

Paul Caller, CEO of Autoglym, said: "It's a great shame when an otherwise fabulous-looking car is blighted with a tell-tale patch of dull paint. As a result of this new research by our R&D team in Letchworth, we now understand why bird droppings are a frighteningly potent hazard to bodywork.

"As bird droppings become ever more prevalent through spring and into summer, motorists must be extremely vigilant to avoid permanent damage, especially those who park their cars under trees at home or at work. The only way to prevent the paint becoming noticeably tarnished is to carefully remove deposits as swiftly as possible."
http://www.autoblog.com/2011/05/04/b...ast-not-by-it/
Finally, just a word for Volvo safety. Some time ago I saw a V70 in a Welsh lane with high banks and hedges (like a Devon lane) there was a four wheel drive John Deer tractor and fully laden muck spreader which had come down the hill and driven right over said Volvo. Close by a fire crew was in attendance asking a couple about the accident. The couple had been in the Volvo. Miraculously, they had been able to open the doors and get out more or less unscathed!

[Ninja59]

Originally Posted by RAN60

Still being a bit sore from my experience just wanted to voice my discuss at the insurance industry.

Long story short, i was hit, driver admitted liability straight off. Car was repaired, no claims bonus is protected (like yours, unless i have 2 incidents in 3 years) but..........

Your premiums will go up next year, regardless of fault, and this goes for all insurers. It ridiculous and sickening. The explanation i had was "because you have been involved in an incident you are classed as being at a higher risk".

I explained that there was no question of fault or liability and i was just driving normal when a car hit me, the reply was "your still seen as more of a risk"!

So apparently when you car gets hit by another it then becomes magnatised to all other cars slightly more than before the incident!!

I hope you are ok and all goes well with the claim but prepare yourself at renewal time!!

That is not strictly true, I happen to know LV (whether this applies to Highway as well as I know there is some strange oddities between the two of them as the policy cover and wording is ever so slightly different - odd for the same company) that they don't charge for Non-fault claims at x 1 at least.

I know many do because of the above, but not all do, you just have to route out the ones that don't.

This is coming from someone that had one NFC on there since 2009, I got provided with another in March thanks to some woman being to close and a van failing to stop.