ecu remap poll

[PNuT]

lol @ possible problems

[John_C]

Let's not even go there

I'd be quite interested to know if the commonly available off-the-shelf remaps (RICA/MTE/BBR/Superchips) have any significant differences in their power delivery mapping, e.g.

I know you can tune cars for high power at the top end but that can mean you don't get quite as much low down and a big WOMF of power when it kicks in.

You can also tune them for more torque and power right across the range so the car is arguably more "driveable" when you're not hammering it and I assume it would be better for day to day use as you won't get caught out of the powerband so often. But it won't feel as fast or probably be quite as fast against a stopwatch in a 0.60 run.

I don't know if any of that is true for any of these maps, or if I'm just talking rollocks, when it comes to tuning T5's maybe things are different?

20 or 30 hp here or there at the top end between the maps looks fairly significant for sure, but I am equally interested in hearing from people who've had one of the maps installed how it altered the character of the car and it's power delivery.

Cheers,
John

[michron11]

i am well pleased with my RICA SPORTS REMAP ON V70 D5 GEARTRONIC had it done at www.pwcars.co.uk who are agents for rica they did it while i waited very professional.would recomend to any one.



V70 D5 210HP 470NM GEARTRONIC ALL 4 490 POUNDS

Mike

[Nuisance]

Originally Posted by charltjr

Let's not even go there

I'd be quite interested to know if the commonly available off-the-shelf remaps (RICA/MTE/BBR/Superchips) have any significant differences in their power delivery mapping, e.g.

I know you can tune cars for high power at the top end but that can mean you don't get quite as much low down and a big WOMF of power when it kicks in.

You can also tune them for more torque and power right across the range so the car is arguably more "driveable" when you're not hammering it and I assume it would be better for day to day use as you won't get caught out of the powerband so often. But it won't feel as fast or probably be quite as fast against a stopwatch in a 0.60 run.

I don't know if any of that is true for any of these maps, or if I'm just talking rollocks, when it comes to tuning T5's maybe things are different?

20 or 30 hp here or there at the top end between the maps looks fairly significant for sure, but I am equally interested in hearing from people who've had one of the maps installed how it altered the character of the car and it's power delivery.

Cheers,
John

There's a lot of sense in that line of thought!

In my quest for a fast T5 I've come to the conclusion that peak BHP figures are a total irrelavence. They are only an indication of a power output at one particular engine speed, and do not truely indicate the power that the car has whilst being driven.

I'd imagine that if salespeople were to quote a power figure averaged out over, say, a 4000 rpm bandwidth then we'd get a better indication of how powerful a vehicle really is.

In the mean time all we can do is to look at the Dyno graphs to see where the power is being developed and for how long.
And of equal importance is the shape of the torque curve.

This is my plot done at the wheels, it is an immensely quick road car, and is as good a car as I've ever driven. The curves are very broad and smooth.

I've removed all numeric info, as I'm not here to spout BHP figures or start the tuner debate, simply to show the shape of a good map/tune

obviously...Upper = torque...Lower = Power @ wheels

[Les, slight limp]

Looks good, at what rpm does the drop off come at?.

Honest question just to see where the line ends so to speak, i think it's pretty obvious given the smooth increase it's a "street" car and not a screamer for show.

[Nuisance]

Originally Posted by Les, slight limp

Looks good, at what rpm does the drop off come at?.

Honest question just to see where the line ends so to speak, i think it's pretty obvious given the smooth increase it's a "street" car and not a screamer for show.

Just under 6K IIRC, without going into the office and digging out the car file, it's all in with my bills and accounts.

That pic was taken zoomed in on the camera, not cropped so I don't have the scale here on the computer.

I've just realised that i've already posted the figures in an earlier post on this thread (DOH)
But let's not get into a yes it is, no it isnt and who's dyno. To me they are of little importance compared to the shape of the curves especially as my coil packs were shot when this plot was done.
295 WHP
420 Nm @ wheels
Boost is about 1.4 bar.
The engine is a 2.3 ME7 revision in a P2 car.

I was running a tired ignition system when that was done, so I should be running a bit more now, it sure feels like it.

One of the great advantages of the custom map is that systems can be tuned to get a very driveable car, This one is an absolute pleasure to drive. The tuners custom modded turbo, and custom map, enable the thing to spool up quickly and take off like a scalded cat, There is enough power for anybody there, unless you're going racing. My thoughts now are no longer on performance enhancements, and have turned to refinements, and maintenance.

I can recommend wholeharedly to get a custom upgrade / re-map done, they may not always produce massively more peak BHP than sales gobledygook driven off the shelf maps, but the end result is way better. It just took a little bit of listening, and then asking and trusting a tuner to get the best from the car, instead of demanding it achieve an irrelevent figure.

If the customer would take a little time to learn to read a dyno plot properly, and choose an upgrade with respect to that then more people would actually get what they want.

You can't blame the tuners for the customers lack of understanding.

It's exactly like going out and buying a Hi-Fi based on how loud it goes.

I know it's so easy to just pick a number and think that'll tell you what your getting, but I've learned that it's not all it's cracked up to be. I had an off the shelf map before this, and there is no comparrison AT ALL! Granted it was much better than the factory map, but it wasn't my ideal performance target.

We should also remeber that our cars are all diferent starting points.

Having had in-depth conversations with an individual that works on police vehicles nationwide nearly all which are standard, there is even a large variation in the performance from one standard T5 to another from the factory. More so than the claimed diference from one re-map to another. And you know what....I believe him.
I've also been in about half a dozen T5's and they all even sounded diferent to each other. I even did a side by side comparison with 4 when I got mine, and they were all diferent too!
So what's the point debating over a published max BHP figure when we're all starting from a diferent base figure. It would be impossible for us all to achieve this published figure anyway. Hence my opinion that it's irrelevent.

[richnsueb]

My Volvo D5 benefited from a Rica Sports Tune remap. Advertised figures were something like 210bhp and 475NM. Achieved (at the wheel) figures were around 175bhp and 445NM. Pre-upgrade dyno rated (at the wheel) was 142bhp and 360NM. Cost £400. Although my car did not acheive advertised figures, it is very quick for an oil burner and the 80 mph to illegal license losing speeds sprint (between 3,000 and 4,000 rpm) is extremely quick, apparently :>)

[Les, slight limp]

I totally agree that the figures at peak are of limited importance, the important thing is to realise your goals and tune for that.

Off the shelf packages also have there place, loads of people don't have the time or inclination to go "in depth" with the tuning of their car so for them package go faster chips do a pretty good job.

Personally iv'e got a carb and points dizzy but if i can achieve a graph similar to that one i'll be happy, regards les.

[carpy]

Is it worth having a custom map done if you've NOT got lots of upgrades like the 19T / downpipe etc.

My 850R just has a performance air filter / performance catback exhaust and the standard 16T turbo.

Would I get more from the car with a custom map? At the moment it's got a RICA 280 put on by the previous owner.

[Nuisance]

Originally Posted by carpy

Is it worth having a custom map done if you've NOT got lots of upgrades like the 19T / downpipe etc.

My 850R just has a performance air filter / performance catback exhaust and the standard 16T turbo.

Would I get more from the car with a custom map? At the moment it's got a RICA 280 put on by the previous owner.

What do you actually want the car to do?

I know you've been down about every possible route on other threads, but what do you really want from it.

Then ask yourself, what do I have to spend ?

If you're already running a Rica 280 then I doubt anything similar (swapping maps, or tweaking maps) will give you your money's worth in terms of major improvements, unless you are specifically unhappy with some way your car performs (such as want more low down pull). They're all same-but-different, if you get my drift, and they all try very hard to get the most from a standard setup. Swaping one manufacturers performance product for another isn't somthing I'd entertain.

You'd be better spending a few hundred on suspension (if yours is standard) rather than changing maps, as a good suspension setup does make a big diference, especially in terms of getting the power down.

Other than keeping the vehicle in good condition, the next step would be looking like at least a grand, and can go up to whatever you have to spend. A small step on the custom upgrade / map front would be a DP/preformance cat, and get the map customised for that, then you could think of a turbo mod, and even fueling mod each with the correct mapping to make most of them, but get a tuners advice, because who knows if your engine is up to any of this.
Some people have been known to take an old worn engine and shout More! More! More! at it, and be massively gutted when it lets go, so isten to what the tuner recommends.
If you want to make the 850R really fast then you'd be well starting off making sure the engine will do what you want it to, and get it stripped and checked over first.

But do yourself a favour (unless you're quite expert) and don't try and select a load of bits and take them to a tuner and say "I want you to make this lot work" that's a real bad way of doing it. The tuner knows what they need to do to achieve a certain goal, and they've a hell of a lot more experience than us, So it's better to choose a tuner, sit down, have a chat and let them do what they do best.

That's what I did and I'm well happy with it. I didn't even ask for green injectors, it's just that it became apparent during the job that it needed them, and I'd given the tuner a budget and a brief, and they fit into it, so it got them.

So I ask the question again....
What do you want from your car?